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The New CBA: Examining the Particulars

NEW YORK, NY - NOVEMBER 26:  NBA Commissioner David Stern (R) and Former Executive Director of the National Basketball Players Association Billy Hunter speak to members of the press to announce a tentative labor agreement to end the 149-day lockout on November 26, 2011 in New York City.  (Photo by Patrick McDermott/Getty Images)

With a handshake agreement in place, most of the major points have been ironed out in the new CBA by the players and owners. Long divided by the size of each side's share of basketball-related income (BRI) and the so-called "system" issues such as the salary cap and the length of contracts, both sides came to a compromise after the owners relented on many of their more extreme demands, and rather than allow the present antitrust lawsuit to move forward, both sides agreed to salvage a 66 game season that will start on Christmas. Although many "B-list" issues such as the eligible age of draft eligible college players and similar are still at large and both sides have to actually vote to ratify the new agreement, nearly all media outlets have reported that the deal will go forward and any outstanding issues will be shuffled into committees that will resolve the problems over the course of the year.

Courtesy of SI's Sam Amick, we have the text of the actual agreement, and can examine the particulars of the new environment the league will operate under for at least the next six years. After the jump, we will review how the new CBA provisions such as the new midlevel exception (MLE), a stiffer luxury tax, and more affect the Lakers' flexibility in free agency, the trade market, and in other areas going forward.

Star-divide

The Exceptions

The bête noire of the owners throughout the process, the exceptions, which allow a team above the cap to exceed it in order to sign free agents, have been blamed for many of the especially bad contracts signed over the course of the last CBA. This was primarily due to the midlevel exception (MLE), tagged to the league's average salary, which allowed teams to sign players to a roughly $5.6 million/year salary for up to five years. Two such signings on the Lakers right now, Metta World Peace ($33 million/5 years) and Steve Blake ($16 million/4 years), are testament to how these contracts, made for generally solid role players, can have poor consequences, as MWP's declining athleticism and offensive game portend poorly for his future prospects and Blake had a horrid first year with the Lakers last season.

The MLE has now been subdivided into different exceptions for teams above and below the tax line. The Lakers, light years above any reasonable luxury tax threshold, obviously fall into the former category. In that case, the Lakers would have access to the "taxpayer midlevel exception," which is detailed here:

Taxpayer Mid-Level Exception: Set at $3M in year 1, growing 3% annually thereafter; maximum contract length of 3 years; can be used every year.

So that's not a terrible loss for the Lakers. One could even argue that being limited to offering roughly $10 million/3 year contracts to one players will encourage the Lakers to be more fiscally responsible in doling out long investments on the outside parts of their rotation. It certainly damages the Lakers' ability to pursue the top end of the B-list free agent spectrum, but there's still enough there to add semi-solid role players -- Mike Dunleavy anyone? -- and the allure of L.A. will be something no CBA will ever be able to legislate. As with many of the provisions here, it will simply encourage smart management, and while the Lakers have been quiet on that front since the Gasol trade, Mitch Kupchak is still a solid GM.

This is especially important since the biannual exception, another provision of the previous CBA allowing a tax team to go above the minimum to sign players, has been limited to non-tax teams. The biannual isn't that much more than the minimum, so this isn't a huge loss either, but again, it gives the Lakers good reason to be judicious in utilizing all of the resources allotted to them.

The Amnesty Clause

As we noted yesterday, the Lakers are interested in Baron Davis and Rashard Lewis, two likely recipients of the amnesty clause, which allows a team to waive a player and exclude their salary from their cap and all luxury tax calculations. New developments, however, have thrown a small wrinkle in how that might actually go down. From the text of the agreement:

A modified waiver process will be utilized for players waived pursuant to the Amnesty rule, under which teams with Room under the Cap can submit competing offers to assume some but not all of the player’s remaining contract. If a player’s contract is claimed in this manner, the remaining portion of the player’s salary will continue to be paid by the team that waived him.

Yikes. So the Lakers' potential interest in any amnesty candidates can be railroaded by a team below the cap offering a token bid on those players, from which they would pay that player that salary for the length of the player's previous deal. For instance, if Baron Davis becomes an amnesty candidate, then team A, which is under the cap, can bid $3 million -- assuming that team has enough space under the cap -- and pay Baron that salary for each of the two remaining years of his contract while the Cavaliers would continue to pay Baron his original contract minus the amount of team A's bid. Moreover, if a team B wanted Baron, they could offer $4 million and would win the bidding.

This noted, this doesn't mean that the Lakers should necessarily abandon all hope for having a shot at some of the amnesty candidates. Let's take a look at the teams under the cap and whether they would have any interest in any of the possible amnesty candidates we discussed over the summer:

  • Denver Nuggets: The Nuggets' current problem is that a good chunk of their roster -- J.R. Smith, Wilson Chandler, and Kenyon Martin -- went off to China, and due to the rules of the Chinese Basketball Association, they will be unable to return until the end of the CBA season in March. So unless any of their players get released for "personal reasons" over the next few weeks, they will have a lot of cap space and some big holes to fill, especially with their premier center Nene becoming a free agent. This could make them a suitor for players such as Rashard Lewis, Brandon Roy, and Mehmet Okur, but they are set at the point with Ty Lawson and Andre Miller, making them an unlikely spot for Davis or Beno Udrih.
  • Sacramento Kings: The Kings, after an utterly baffling draft day deal that saw them perform the unlikely feat of taking on salary in order to drop down in the draft, have a very full backcourt between Jimmer Fredette, Tyreke Evans, Francisco Garcia, Pooh Jeter, Isaiah Thomas, and a potentially resigned Marcus Thornton. However that shakes out, it's doubtful they pursue Baron, Roy, or Udrih, although they may be interested in adding a center such as Okur with Samuel Dalembert hitting free agency and an otherwise young frontcourt.
  • Indiana Pacers: The Pacers are a fairly solid team with some nice young pieces and a big, gaping hole at the four, where Tyler Hansbrough and Josh McRoberts aren't ideal solutions. Their high tempo offense that emphasizes the three ball could make them a landing place for Lewis, who doesn't solve their problems at the position but would provide some quality depth. After trading for George Hill, the Pacers have a generally solid backcourt between Hill, Darren Collison, A.J. Price, and Brandon Rush -- and Davis would be an unlikely candidate due to his attitude issues on marginal squads and Bird's reputation for selecting high character players -- but they might be interested in filling the hole on the wings potentially left vacant by free agent Mike Dunleavy.
  • Memphis Grizzlies: One of the league's surprise teams last year, the Grizzlies potentially look stacked with Rudy Gay returning to a rotation that was already a solid playoff squad last year. There are no explicit holes on the roster, although as a potential contender, it always is smart to be looking for more depth. Of all the teams on this list, Memphis has the greatest possibility of putting a bid in for Baron Davis, although the point is fairly filled between Mike Conley, Greivis Vasquez, Ishmael Smith, and Josh Selby.
  • New Jersey Nets: With next season as the last year on Deron Williams' contract, expect the Nets to throw the kitchen sink and then some at the wall to keep him in town. Davis isn't likely due to the presence of Williams and former Laker Jordan Farmar, but every other position is open season for the Nets. They might want to preserve their cap space for a run at some of the bigger free agents on the market -- SI's Chris Mannix reports that they're interested in Dallas free agent Caron Butler -- but they could run the entire gamut of amnesty candidates with all the holes on that roster.
  • Washington Wizards: A young, upcoming squad that likely had the best draft night in the league during the summer, the Wizards will be interested in the amnesty candidates primarily to add some veteran presence to what is otherwise a very young roster. Davis is likely out due to John Wall eating up the grand majority of the minutes at the point and the fact that he would almost certainly dog it on what is all but guaranteed to be a bottom feeder next season. Rest of the roster is much more open, so there's no telling what direction GM Ernie Grunfeld may go, but one would think they would want to maximize the minutes of rookies Jan Vesely, Chris Singleton, and Shelvin Mack along with the rest of their young core.
  • New Orleans Hornets: Chris Paul strikes me as too classy to pull off a Melo-esque drama by holding his team hostage with a trade, but there's no doubt that the pressure for the Hornets to trade Paul will be overwhelming if the team struggles this season. With David West and Carl Landry likely leaving and the rest of the roster besides Emeka Okafor a steaming pile of crap, the Hornets have no shortage of needs, so expect them to be active in pursuing amnesty candidates. Like many other examples on this list, Davis isn't likely because the team's marquee player eats up most of the minutes in front of him, not to mention the unceremonious way that he left New Orleans earlier in his career.
  • Charlotte Bobcats: In a depressing trend that makes one wonder how the Lakers of all teams could be so utterly devoid of talent at point guard, Davis is unlikely to come to Charlotte due to the presence of D.J. Augustin and Kemba Walker, but Charlotte could look for candidates elsewhere to fill the copious holes on the roster. With Rich Cho in charge, Charlotte finally looks like they are in relatively capable hands, but it's likely they have a quiet summer while they start their rebuilding process.
  • Minnesota Timberwolves: According to ESPN's Marc Stein, Rick Adelman is interested in signing Roy, if only to rectify the absolutely horrid Randy Foye draft night trade, five years and some missing knee cartilage too late. The keys of the offense will be handed to Spanish phenom Ricky Rubio and Luke Ridnour, one of the league's better backup point guards, will finish out that rotation, so Davis likely won't land here, and the huge glut of combo forwards on the roster likely precludes any pursuing of Lewis.
  • Los Angeles Clippers: The irony of Davis ending back on the Clippers aside, this might be possible given that second year player Eric Bledsoe needs significantly more seasoning, Mo Williams is a two guard in a point guard's body, and Blake Griffin would certainly welcome the main provider of his alley-oops back. Aside from that, the Clippers could use depth at nearly every position besides the five, but it's more a question of how much they want to proceed with their youth movement.
  • Houston Rockets: Daryl Morey is apparently putting all his chips in for Nene, which makes sense given the rather big hole the Rockets have at the five with the undersized but defensively masterful Chuck Hayes a free agent and the only other center being woeful draft bust Hasheem Thabeet. I wouldn't put anything past Morey, who has been one of the league's best GMs in maximizing value in trades and other transactions, but there are no other explicit holes on the roster besides the three, there's a huge amount of young players with athleticism and high upside who need playing time, and he might need all that cap space to pursue Nene given the number of suitors interested in him. Davis certainly isn't heading here with the massively underrated Kyle Lowry heading the point and Spur-killer Goran Dragic backing him up.
  • Detroit Pistons: The Pistons are a toxic morass after the way last season went, and Joe Dumars seems to have finally come to the realization that this team needs to be blown sky high and rebuilt. It's hard to say where Detroit will go besides handing the keys to the team to Brandon Knight, Rodney Stuckey, and Greg Monroe, but Dumars could possibly supplement the rotation with some amnesty signings, especially for the back end of the frontcourt. That Davis would be terrible in this kind of environment is a given, and due to the presence of Knight and Will Bynum at the point, it's doubtful Dumars has any interest in seeing how that would play out.
  • Toronto Raptors: If I was Toronto, I would throw the kitchen sink and then some at Tyson Chandler and Nene and pray one of them bites since they desperately need some toughness and a defensive presence in the middle, especially with Dallas defensive guru Dwane Casey coming in. That might preclude the Raptors from chasing any amnesty candidates to preserve their cap room, although they might look for some wing depth with Linas Kleiza recovering from knee surgery. Jose Calderon and Jerryd Bayless offer a pretty compelling reason that Davis won't cross the border.
  • Golden State Warriors: The thought of Davis returning to his old stomping grounds in the Bay is interesting, although the presence of Stephen Curry, Monta Ellis, Klay Thompson, and Charles Jenkins probably would stop that reunion. The Warriors have been one of the most prominent teams interested in the services of Brandon Roy, and they'll also be looking for frontcourt depth behind David Lee and Andris Biedrins, not that the defense will likely improve any.

So basically, if the Grizzlies and Clippers pass on Davis, the Lakers are very likely to have an opportunity to nab him after he clears waivers. Essentially every other amnesty candidate is fair game, and the Lakers would mostly have to depend on luck for any of them to clear the process. Ultimately, Davis' worst characteristic -- his lackadaisical attitude and tendency to dog it on bad or rebuilding teams -- might be the Lakers' best asset in ensuring that he's still available following this process.

The Carmelo Rule

Or the lack of it rather. Despite much hullabaloo about the owners desiring to avoid a repeat of the Carmelo Anthony situation, extend-and-trades, in which a team signs a player to an extension using its Bird rights and then immediately trades the player, will be legal. The text reads:

Extension-and-trades permitted, except maximum length of any such extended contract is 3 years (e.g., 2 new years if player during last year of his old contract) and max annual increases are 4.5 percent. If a player signs a contract extension for a longer period or higher amount than would have been permitted for an extension-and-trade, then the team is prohibited from trading the player for a period of six months following the date of the extension. If a team acquires a player in a trade, then, for a period of six months following the date of the trade, the team is prohibited from signing the player to a contract extension for a longer period or higher amount than would have been permitted for an extension-and-trade.

In other words, if Dwight Howard wants to come to the Lakers, he'll have to accept a slightly smaller contract -- 4.5% annual increases instead of the 7.5% ones if he stayed with Orlando -- in any potential extend-and-trade, but that's hardly a deal breaker. With no rule present to preclude such discussion, expect a veritable ton of media frenzy around Howard and Chris Paul next season, and the Lakers will almost certainly be in those conversations.

The Luxury Tax

Or again, the absence of such. In lieu of a hard cap, the owners had sought to impose a more punitive luxury tax along with increasing repeater fees to discourage heavy spending by the Lakers, Mavericks, and similar teams. The saving grace is that this will not go into effect until year three of the new CBA, giving the Lakers significant breathing room to plan out their roster, and hopefully time for Buss to stash money from the Lakers' gargantuan $3 billion Time Warner media deal, which gives the team $150 million each year. While the Lakers will certainly look towards being more circumspect with any deals they hand out from this point forward, it is very unlikely that Buss will condone any significant salary dump moves so long as the team's championship window is open, and by that point, Laker management should be able to revamp the Lakers' core moving forward.

While there are numerous smaller issues present -- sign-and-trades being allowed for tax teams for the first two years so long as they don't exceed the tax by $4 million, the new "stretch" exception, or the possibility of implementing a "two and through" rule for the draft -- they are minor in comparison to the other issues for the Lakers. In any case, as numerous writers throughout the NBA blogosphere have noted in excellent work all summer, the effect of a more restrictive system is that it puts a big impetus upon smart management to work around the rules in place, and per above, the Lakers aren't bereft of talent in that department. Even with the new system certainly not beneficial for the Lakers, there are plenty of tools in place for the Lakers to retool this summer and move back into the title chase next season.

UPDATE (4:07 AM): I seem to have forgotten four other teams also under the cap. They don't change anything I've written above about Davis' availability, but for the sake of completeness, I've written some short summaries of them above.

Follow this author on Twitter @brosales12.

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Looking at pics of Hunter and Stern pre- and post-CBA, it seems the key was the wearing of ties.

Bastards needed a stylist to get this deal done. They should have called me!

You're only a success for the moment that you complete a successful act. - Tex Winter
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by SoCalGal on Nov 28, 2011 9:47 AM PST reply actions  

Some kinds of ugly just can't be remedied.

Although, I’m sure your talents are excellent. :)

"Winning takes talent; to repeat takes character." - John Wooden

by Joshua S on Nov 28, 2011 11:30 AM PST via mobile up reply actions  

Sounds good.

Good job summing it all up.

I’m just happy to be able to watch some NBA soon

Bamboozled.

by PoPs_737 on Nov 28, 2011 11:00 AM PST reply actions  

Sorry if I glossed over it, but...

Do we know where the soft cap will be yet?

Great insights on some of the new provisions, Ben.

"Winning takes talent; to repeat takes character." - John Wooden

by Joshua S on Nov 28, 2011 11:14 AM PST via mobile reply actions  

It's based on the players percent of BRI

so at 50%, the cap will be set based on last year’s revenues. I think it was at 58 million last year, so it’ll prolly be something around there again this year with luxury tax starting around 70 million. But with projections they expect that to increase from the owners side

"These things happened. They were glorious and they changed the world... and then we fucked up the end game." - Charlie Wilson
"I think that all the silence is worse than all the violence." -Lupe Fiasco

by Marty Mart on Nov 28, 2011 12:21 PM PST up reply actions  

Thanks Marty!

Larry Coon has a great piece up with side-by-side comparisons to the 2005 CBA. That shed some light on the major details. Larry’s knows his stuff and is a great resource for breaking down operations.

http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/page/CBA-111128/how-new-nba-deal-compares-last-one

"Winning takes talent; to repeat takes character." - John Wooden

by Joshua S on Nov 28, 2011 5:17 PM PST up reply actions  

Great Stuff and great breakdown and information

In my humble and insignificant opinion the Lakers best hopes for landing players on the cheap would be to focus on landing players who are about to pass their prime, have already received a large contract from another team, and doens’t have a history or potential for being injured. Except maybe Grant Hill. They still need athleticism and desperately need an additional player who can create his own shot on the perimeter. Every starter besides Fisher can post up. They really need outside shooting badly.

Other team’s ability to leave fisher alone and double team any player in the post because Fisher and Blake can’t hit an open 3 when left open hurts the team so much.

"Hate me or love me. Its one or the other; always has been. Hate my game, my swagger. Hate my fadeaway, my hunger. Hate that I'm a veteran. A champion. Hate that. Hate it with all your heart. And hate that I'm loved for the exact same reasons." - Kobe Jelly Bean Bryant

by Jelly Bean on Nov 28, 2011 11:16 AM PST reply actions  

Pass on Baron Davis

He is not going to miraculously find motivation to stay focus on winning if he plays for the Lakers. Plus, he likes the inactive list. I don’t want Mike Brown to have to deal with Kobe and that knucklehead. It’s just too much.

I like the Rashard Lewis idea even if Odom is still on the team. He just spot up shoot all day at the three and four. I also like the gamble that is Greg Oden. I’m pretty certain that Bynum won’t be healthy the entire season. Oden would a fine gamble.

by E-ROC on Nov 28, 2011 11:39 AM PST via mobile reply actions  

not a bad idea.

If he comes cheap he can be good for winning one or two playoff games.

"Hate me or love me. Its one or the other; always has been. Hate my game, my swagger. Hate my fadeaway, my hunger. Hate that I'm a veteran. A champion. Hate that. Hate it with all your heart. And hate that I'm loved for the exact same reasons." - Kobe Jelly Bean Bryant

by Jelly Bean on Nov 28, 2011 12:49 PM PST up reply actions  

Oden is an excellent center. Just has astronomically bad luck.

Obviously, if we do get him, it has to be for a very low price, which is highly unlikely.

"If you have a debate with a scholar, you can win. If you have a debate with an ignorant person, you will definitely lose."

"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the universe." - Albert Einstein

by LakerAce on Nov 28, 2011 2:55 PM PST up reply actions  

He's a RFA. Unless someone gives him a nutty offer, he'll take the QO and come back to Portland.

@brosales12

To secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself. -- Sun Tzu

by Ben R on Nov 28, 2011 3:03 PM PST up reply actions  

Basically, no chance he signs with the Lakers.

"If you have a debate with a scholar, you can win. If you have a debate with an ignorant person, you will definitely lose."

"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the universe." - Albert Einstein

by LakerAce on Nov 28, 2011 7:08 PM PST up reply actions  

Low as in free?

You're only a success for the moment that you complete a successful act. - Tex Winter
Tweetness

by SoCalGal on Nov 28, 2011 3:24 PM PST up reply actions  

Low as in he pays the Lakers to play.

"If you have a debate with a scholar, you can win. If you have a debate with an ignorant person, you will definitely lose."

"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the universe." - Albert Einstein

by LakerAce on Nov 28, 2011 7:08 PM PST up reply actions  

Sounds good

So glad this is done with and I’ll actually get to watch basketball on Christmas. Hoping for a different result than previous Christmases!

I'll do whatever it takes to win games, whether it's sitting on a bench waving a towel, handing a cup of water to a teammate, or hitting the game-winning shot.- Kobe Bryant

by nyyrocks29 on Nov 28, 2011 12:41 PM PST reply actions  

I hope so to

but just seeing our puple and gold on the court is cause for happiness.

"Hate me or love me. Its one or the other; always has been. Hate my game, my swagger. Hate my fadeaway, my hunger. Hate that I'm a veteran. A champion. Hate that. Hate it with all your heart. And hate that I'm loved for the exact same reasons." - Kobe Jelly Bean Bryant

by Jelly Bean on Nov 28, 2011 12:50 PM PST up reply actions  

so with a shortened season, does this affect the game scheduling? does it mean teams will be play more games per week?

"They’re a very special group of men. Cherish them, you will not see their like again."

by chaucer on Nov 28, 2011 12:56 PM PST reply actions  

They will be playing a few back-to-back-to-back games, between 1-3 for each team.

You're only a success for the moment that you complete a successful act. - Tex Winter
Tweetness

by SoCalGal on Nov 28, 2011 1:03 PM PST up reply actions  

For the back-to-back-to-back games

I really hope Brown limits the minutes of the starters, and I think it will be a test of his ability to take control of the team (i.e. will he be able to actually get Kobe to play reduced minutes, especially if the Lakers are losing the game)

by neokoros on Nov 28, 2011 2:04 PM PST up reply actions  

Payback.

The biggest pains in the butt during negotiations will feel the wrath of the league.

"Winning takes talent; to repeat takes character." - John Wooden

by Joshua S on Nov 28, 2011 7:01 PM PST via mobile up reply actions  

Waiting for the season…

The measure of a woman is not her looks. It is her passion, her femininity, her character and her pride. My passion, my femininity, my character and my pride have been going strong for 28 years. The world is at my feet.

by California Girly Girl on Nov 28, 2011 1:20 PM PST up reply actions  

It's an increase to about 4 games per week per team

before it was an average 3.5 games per week per team

"These things happened. They were glorious and they changed the world... and then we fucked up the end game." - Charlie Wilson
"I think that all the silence is worse than all the violence." -Lupe Fiasco

by Marty Mart on Nov 28, 2011 1:57 PM PST up reply actions  

Good stuff Ben

I like to call the new luxury tax the anti-laker tax system

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Faith is remaining certain in the face of doubt. You’re not sure how it’s going to end, but you’re constantly of the belief that it will end the way you want it to and the way you always believed it to end, and that’s on top - Derek Fisher

by lakergirl on Nov 28, 2011 3:03 PM PST reply actions  

Ugh, the amnesty process sucks balls.

All it takes is one team offering the minimum and you’re screwed, and that’s quite the gauntlet any prospective amnesty candidate would have to go through. Like I said above, Davis might be the only semi-realistic possibility in the process since the rebuilding teams will avoid him like the plague and the contending teams are mostly set at the point, but all it takes is one nutty GM to change that.

We have basically no shot at Roy, Udrih, Okur, or anyone else though. Too much of an incentive for a team under the cap to pick those guys up for basically nothing.

@brosales12

To secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself. -- Sun Tzu

by Ben R on Nov 28, 2011 3:22 PM PST reply actions  

The handful of under cap teams are gonna find themselves loaded with formerly overpaid stars.

THAT will be interesting…

Watch out for the Nuggets.

"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal

by timbo on Nov 29, 2011 8:52 PM PST up reply actions  

What, Roy/Lewis isn't going to change the future of that team.

Especially since they’re liable to lose Nene in free agency and they have three players stuck in China.

@brosales12

To secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself. -- Sun Tzu

by Ben R on Nov 29, 2011 8:55 PM PST up reply actions  

So...

Can that team turn around and waive that just as easily?

Silver Screen and Roll

Follow me on Twitter: @wondahbap

by wondahbap on Nov 29, 2011 9:16 PM PST up reply actions  

You mean if the team gets an amnesty player, can they get rid of them?

They won’t be making much (unless a team bids like $4-5 million, which I can’t imagine is a logical move for most of these guys), so it wouldn’t be that hard to eat the money by waiving them. I’d imagine that most teams would want these players for depth and then as trade chips.

@brosales12

To secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself. -- Sun Tzu

by Ben R on Nov 29, 2011 9:27 PM PST up reply actions  

amnesty question

The player has to except the offer correct? So if one of these basement teams under the cap, offer first, the Lakers can still make an offer and get Davis if he wants to play in LA, right?

by kingofatlanta on Nov 28, 2011 4:20 PM PST via iPhone app reply actions  

I wondered about that too.

You're only a success for the moment that you complete a successful act. - Tex Winter
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by SoCalGal on Nov 28, 2011 4:24 PM PST up reply actions  

that is exactly what I was thinking.

Mainly along the lines of how much of the choice the player has as far as where he plays.

"Hate me or love me. Its one or the other; always has been. Hate my game, my swagger. Hate my fadeaway, my hunger. Hate that I'm a veteran. A champion. Hate that. Hate it with all your heart. And hate that I'm loved for the exact same reasons." - Kobe Jelly Bean Bryant

by Jelly Bean on Nov 28, 2011 4:39 PM PST up reply actions  

No, the highest offer from teams under the cap wins.

And the player has no choice in the matter. So if someone offered say the minimum for an amnesty candidate and every other team passed on him, then that player would go to the team and be paid the minimum.

@brosales12

To secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself. -- Sun Tzu

by Ben R on Nov 28, 2011 4:44 PM PST up reply actions  

Well that makes sense

damn!

"Hate me or love me. Its one or the other; always has been. Hate my game, my swagger. Hate my fadeaway, my hunger. Hate that I'm a veteran. A champion. Hate that. Hate it with all your heart. And hate that I'm loved for the exact same reasons." - Kobe Jelly Bean Bryant

by Jelly Bean on Nov 28, 2011 4:50 PM PST up reply actions  

Personally, I don't get it.

A player isn’t going to play hard for a team he was forced to go to and may have no future with.

"These things happened. They were glorious and they changed the world... and then we fucked up the end game." - Charlie Wilson
"I think that all the silence is worse than all the violence." -Lupe Fiasco

by Marty Mart on Nov 28, 2011 6:23 PM PST up reply actions  

Agreed

Especially because those being amnesty are more likely to be the players that aren’t playing as hard as they could in the first place.

by neokoros on Nov 28, 2011 8:12 PM PST up reply actions  

Punishment for having been overpaid...

Very much like the draft — except it will be for guys on the downhill side of their careers. A chemistry nightmare, but a smart under-cap team (i.e. Denver) will be able to steal EVERYBODY for pennies on the dollar.

"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal

by timbo on Nov 29, 2011 8:56 PM PST up reply actions  

Denver isn't going to do that

their new owners are smart enough to know that they already have good pieces, now they just need a couple better ones which require investment.

"These things happened. They were glorious and they changed the world... and then we fucked up the end game." - Charlie Wilson
"I think that all the silence is worse than all the violence." -Lupe Fiasco

by Marty Mart on Nov 30, 2011 12:20 PM PST up reply actions  

But can he be traded in the same season?

So, lets say some team (under cap) picks up rashad lewis for 2mm, can they then trade him to a team over the cap in the same season?

by Datuca on Nov 28, 2011 11:52 PM PST up reply actions  

I would guess that it's the same rules that apply to normal free agents.

Have to wait three months to do so.

@brosales12

To secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself. -- Sun Tzu

by Ben R on Nov 28, 2011 11:56 PM PST up reply actions  

The perfect trade!

Everyone wins: http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=76v8bvz
 
hornets: pau gasol & shannon brown: chris paul & david west
gasol and paul have roughly equal value, since paul’s higher ceiling is mitigated by his injuries and gasol’s better defense (a big will always have the advantage due to the nba’s rules). since david west is both injured for this year and a free agent, it makes no sense for the hornets to sign him and brown can give some depth at pg/sg.
 
orlando: andrew bynum & steve blake: dwight howard & aaron gray
when healthy bynum’s the 2nd best center in the league, and he’s several yrs younger. His advanced defensive stats from last year almost equaled dwight’s, while his offensive stats are depressed since he was played 3rd fiddle on the lakers. Since orlando will use the amnesty clause on arenas, blake can help as a backup pg.
 
this allows the hornets/magic to actually get nearly equal value for their stars who may very well leave in free agency in a year, while the lakers end up with 3 of the top 10 players in the league.
 
what does everyone else think?

by adityalahiri on Nov 28, 2011 4:34 PM PST reply actions  

He declined his player option, so he's a free agent.

I’m still trying to wrap my head around the relevant rules, but you can’t S&T if it puts you $4 million over the tax, and we’re so far over the line it’s somewhat ridiculous.

@brosales12

To secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself. -- Sun Tzu

by Ben R on Nov 28, 2011 4:52 PM PST up reply actions  

Hornets would never do that

Gasol and CP3 do not have anywhere near equal value, and David West is far superior to shannon even if we resign him.

I could see a trade with gasol, blake, and brown (if resigned) for Dwight.

by NewCavsfan on Nov 28, 2011 4:57 PM PST up reply actions  

I don't think the Hornets will go for that trade either

but, we don’t have to offer something of equal value to Orlando or the Hornets, if they trade it would trade because they are afraid of losing their superstar to FA for nothing. The Hornets and Magic will just take the best offer they can get from around the league IMO so our trade potential with those two teams depends as much on what other teams offer as much as anything else.

by neokoros on Nov 28, 2011 8:17 PM PST up reply actions  

Glad to see the Trade Machine is still functioning :)

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by steffun4tw on Nov 28, 2011 7:10 PM PST up reply actions  

Glad they have a deal in place and for the record

Im on Team Davis! Bring Baron in as he is exponentially better than Fisher. Who would the Lakers use their amnesty clause on? Walton maybe?

Da Bears....enuff said

by EmmCeee on Nov 28, 2011 5:06 PM PST reply actions  

Definitely Walton, assuming he doesn't retire.

If he does — and the Lakers obviously would want him to do so — then it’s either Blake or MWP, and that would depend on what the Lakers do in free agency and trades. If the Lakers trade Odom for Iggy for instance, then MWP is gone, and if they sign Baron, then Blake is likely out the door.

@brosales12

To secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself. -- Sun Tzu

by Ben R on Nov 28, 2011 5:13 PM PST up reply actions  

That'd be a bad trade

AI2 is a good player, and his defense would be nice for the back court, but anything that removes Odom kills the Lakers dead unless it involves bringing another big of equal caliber in. I get that they’re pretty similar players statistically, but even if Iguodala was better than Odom on paper (which he isn’t, by the way), you’re losing a player who does so many things for the Lakers both in the rotation and the locker room for a player whose total contribution would be signifigantly smaller. If Bynum goes down, Iguodala isn’t going to step into his shoes. He’s a good defender, but he’s not going to keep Marc Gasol off the boards. He’s not going to get any opposing bigs into foul trouble. And even though he’s younger, he’s statistically declining, while Odom just had arguably the best year of his career. The only positive to that trade I see is taking some pressure off Kobe defensively, but even that is kind of smoke and mirrors since the Laker interior defense would suffer with Caracter out there instead of Odom.

by Derek Fisher Fan on Nov 29, 2011 12:54 AM PST up reply actions  

You're underselling Iggy a lot.

Dude is one of the league’s best wing defenders and probably the best behind Tony Allen. Can guard ones through threes, adds a ton of athleticism to a roster sorely lacking in it, can distribute the rock, is an insanely good finisher around the rim, can create opportunities on drives from the perimeter, and is pretty much solid in every attribute besides shooting. I disagree pretty strongly that he’s an inferior player to Odom, who isn’t as good as a defender by a long shot (which says much more about Iggy rather than Odom) and while he makes it up on the offensive end, it doesn’t close the gap by that much. Iggy has to be his team’s primary offensive threat — which he isn’t suited for and is a huge argument towards making him a fourth option on a better team — AND guard the other team’s best wing threat every night and he does it pretty damn well.

Moreover, you’re completely off-base in terms of where the statistics stand on this issue, IMO. Odom had his best statistical season at age 31 by shooting way higher than his career norms, which has been pretty well-established as a neon warning sign for “fluke,” and the possibility of him matching those numbers in a new offense next season is next to nothing. He’s also nearing the last year of his deal (as his ‘12-’13 deal is non-guaranteed if he’s waived for the season), and he’s the Lakers’ only means of improving via trade. At the same time, the Lakers should understandably be leery of handing Odom an extension going through his mid-30s, as he’s only going to get worse from this juncture as his mobility slips away, not better. Iggy is still only 27, one of the league’s best two-way wings, and as I noted above, been misplaced as the primary option on a mediocre team — that has constantly played at one of the league’s slower paces despite all the athletes on the roster — when he would benefit tremendously from being able to play off Kobe, Gasol, and Bynum. It isn’t his fault that the paint gets walled off for him on drives due to the fact that the other options on his team are crappy at that end, and his per-minute statistics don’t show any big decline last season.

As for the depth issues, as I’ve noted several times throughout the summer, the market for frontcourt players is pretty deep (Jeff Foster, Joel Przybilla, Josh McRoberts, Troy Murphy, hell even Kwame is a fine backup center), so Odom is more of a fungible asset than you think. Obviously, none of the players mentioned can equal his production, but they’re fine for holding down the fort if the Lakers assume a more traditional rotation (with Gasol, Bynum, and each of their respective backups). Meanwhile, getting Iggy solves the problem of dealing with a declining Artest, it lifts a big burden on Kobe to be the sole perimeter creator, it gives the team (and Mike Brown namely) a very versatile and dominating defender, and goes a long way towards solving the athleticism deficit on the team. I disagree pretty strongly that the Lakers’ defense takes any drop (considering that most of the backups I mentioned above are fairly solid in their own right), and Iggy gives the defense a lot of dynamism on the wings that has been eroding with Artest’s decline.

@brosales12

To secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself. -- Sun Tzu

by Ben R on Nov 29, 2011 2:20 AM PST up reply actions  

No I'm Really Not.

I live in Tucson, I go to UofA, I’m familiar with Iggy, I like the dude. But he’s no Lamar Odom any way you slice it.

Even the best wing defenders get beat more often than they stop anyone on the NBA level. And the “has been his team’s best offensive threat” is a moot point. Ron Artest has been multiple NBA team’s best offensive threats and without Yao he was still ocassionally that sort of player when Houston traded him. His game isn’t all that different than Iggys. He’d be the third or fourth option as a Laker and hasn’t shown any ability to score off the ball like Odom has.

I’m not completely off base on the statistics thing either, unless you’re saying basketball-reference.com is wrong. Iguodala is coming off his worst year. You can call Odom’s season a fluke, but even if you discard it, Odom still outpaced Iguodala in most areas in advanced stat land, pretty much every year of Iguodala’s career. Were all those years flukes, too? I didn’t say anywhere that I think the Lakers should extend Odom for the long term, but his contract runs out just about when the Lakers are going to have to do some major rebuilding or retooling anyway. Replacing him with a player who is younger but not better isn’t going to stave that inevitability off.

And just because you’ve noted something several times doesn’t mean it’s right. Even if those players do become available at the Lakers budget, that doesn’t mean they would contribute anything meaningful to the team. As you said they can’t replace Odom’s contribution and that’s all that needs to be said there. The Lakers do need a marginally effective backup center, but they need two and Bynum to stay healthy if they don’t have Odom.

And you really want the ball on the perimeter more? Feel free to look up how much better the Lakers record was when the majority of their points came from the interior. You’re giving away an interior scorer for a guy who didn’t look like he could score from anywhere consistently last year, but fine, if you want to blame a walled off interior (which assumes that the vast majority of NBA teams aren’t bad defensively, which is an assumption I’d argue) that still doesn’t mean that the Lakers should be going away from the middle.

Kobe being Kobe is absolutely necessary for the Lakers interior game, but the last thing they need is someone else not passing to Pau or Bynum. If the Lakers really want to take pressure off Kobe, they need to go into the post even more. They need to get the other team’s bigmen into foul trouble more consistently.

As for the defensive part, I will agree that it would be nice to have better play on the wings. But most of the Laker’s defensive problems last year could’ve been fixed by better team defense. For whatever reason (probably due to the lack of practice), the team’s defense wasn’t ever in sync the way it was two years ago. Kobe already has a fairly pressure free role on defense, though, and he responded to that most nights by not bothering to play any at all. Iguodala taking the other team’s best player won’t stop Kobe from leaving dudes wide open to shoot 3 pointers all night long.

Again, I like Iguodala but he’s a definite downgrade for the team if the price is Odom.

by Derek Fisher Fan on Nov 29, 2011 8:03 PM PST up reply actions  

Odom is not an interior scorer

He does lay-ups, but most of his points come off penetration or jump shots

"These things happened. They were glorious and they changed the world... and then we fucked up the end game." - Charlie Wilson
"I think that all the silence is worse than all the violence." -Lupe Fiasco

by Marty Mart on Nov 30, 2011 12:22 PM PST up reply actions  

why does the amnesty clause only apply to one player pef team?

I don’t see how being able to cut players but still pay out their contracts hurts anyone.

"I promise you, we’re going to build a dictating, dominating, attacking defense. I’ve said it a million times. It’s not a slight on our offense, but we’re not going to win any world championship until we have that." - A.J. Smith

by njg425 on Nov 28, 2011 5:46 PM PST reply actions  

Because the "rich" teams will cheat

The big money teams would go ahead and sign big contracts, dump the player whenever they wanted and the $$ wouldn’t count towards the salary cap…this means the “poor” teams would just get leftovers.

by BaldBilly on Nov 28, 2011 6:18 PM PST up reply actions  

One per team

because you have to make sure GMs are being somewhat held accountable for their decisions.

"These things happened. They were glorious and they changed the world... and then we fucked up the end game." - Charlie Wilson
"I think that all the silence is worse than all the violence." -Lupe Fiasco

by Marty Mart on Nov 28, 2011 6:24 PM PST up reply actions  

I'm All for Baron Davis

I get why people worry about his motivation, but he really only needs to be better than Shannon Brown was last year to justify the Lakers adding him to their roster. I think he can do that even unmotivated, and motivated he potentially adds a lot more. I’m intrigued by Lewis for a lot of reasons, but I don’t think he immediately fills a hole like Davis does.

 Of course I am hoping for Brandon Roy but I can’t imagine him slipping very far once Portland Amnestys him, and even if he does someone would probably pay more than the Lakers could for him.

by Derek Fisher Fan on Nov 29, 2011 1:02 AM PST reply actions  

On Roy

definitely more than likely someone else pays more than mini-mid-level for him

"These things happened. They were glorious and they changed the world... and then we fucked up the end game." - Charlie Wilson
"I think that all the silence is worse than all the violence." -Lupe Fiasco

by Marty Mart on Nov 29, 2011 11:24 AM PST up reply actions  

Here's some more information on amnesty bidding

http://www.latimes.com/sports/basketball/nba/lakers/la-sp-1129-lakers-20111129,0,4502375.story?track=rss

If this is correct, the Lakers can only offer the mini-mid level exception to amnesty players at 3 years and 9.4 million dollars. The player has no say in where they are going and they go to the highest bidding team. If two teams bid the same amount (i.e. mid level or mini-mid level), the player goes to the team with the worse record in the previous year.

Also the amnestied player will not get a double paycheck (and not thus not get rewarded for not living up to their potential), their paycheck from their new team will go directly to their old team to help offset the salary the original team is paying.

by neokoros on Nov 29, 2011 2:34 AM PST reply actions  

That's a confusing piece.

My impression was that if the amnesty players clear the modified waiver process, they’re essentially free agents, from which they can go wherever they want. Moreover, only teams under the cap get to bid on free agents — the Lakers basically have to sit until they go through every team under the cap, so they’re not “bidding” until any of those players clear waivers, after which they can offer the minimum or part of the “mini” MLE. That salary will not count against their previous contract, and they will be fully compensated for their original deal.

@brosales12

To secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself. -- Sun Tzu

by Ben R on Nov 29, 2011 2:40 AM PST up reply actions  

But if there are only a very few teams under the line and able to bid...

………….. what’s to keep somebody like Denver, with 3 players in China, from “bidding” $2M each on 5 guys, say, and winning them all due to lack of competitive bidders?

Nobody good will clear the process, unless I’m missing something. The handful of teams under the line will be instantly stacked.

"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal

by timbo on Nov 29, 2011 9:22 PM PST up reply actions  

Sure, but they need all the space they can muster to have a shot at keeping Nene.

And not everyone on the list would be attractive to them. You’re right though in that nearly everyone with an ounce of talent is going to be signed by a team under the cap. As I noted above, the only semi-realistic option is Davis since he’s a toxic option for most of these teams.

@brosales12

To secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself. -- Sun Tzu

by Ben R on Nov 29, 2011 9:30 PM PST up reply actions  

Can we just amnesty Kobe?

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by imposibol on Nov 29, 2011 5:28 AM PST reply actions  

that sounds imposibol

"Hate me or love me. Its one or the other; always has been. Hate my game, my swagger. Hate my fadeaway, my hunger. Hate that I'm a veteran. A champion. Hate that. Hate it with all your heart. And hate that I'm loved for the exact same reasons." - Kobe Jelly Bean Bryant

by Jelly Bean on Nov 29, 2011 9:20 AM PST up reply actions  

Not when we can trade him

and get Farmar or Ariza back. We might be able to even get Iggy with him.

I hear we might need to clear some cap room to get AMMO back though with his max deal, so amnesty-ing Kobe might work after all.

by neokoros on Nov 29, 2011 11:21 PM PST up reply actions  

I Unironically Want Ammo Back

Everyone always said him taking practices too serious caused them to be really competitive, and to a man the Lakers all said their practices were too soft this season.

by Derek Fisher Fan on Nov 30, 2011 2:07 AM PST up reply actions  

I wouldn't mind ammo back either

His defense would be a liability on a contending squad, but I love the guy.

I am also not surprised he took practices super seriously, since that’s the only time he got to play.

by neokoros on Nov 30, 2011 2:43 AM PST up reply actions  

Rule 91 of the new CBA

the lakers get skrewed as many times as possible for basketball reasons

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