Team Pessimism Extends Winning Streak, More Cancellations On The Way

by DexterFishmore on Oct 28, 2011 2:56 PM PDT in The &!$%ing Lockout

The Friday talks in NYC have ended without agreement on a new labor deal. For the first time this week, the two sides took up the question of how to divide league revenues, and from there the discussions quickly ran aground. Here's what we've been told:

The players have offered to accept 52.5 percent of BRI. The owners are standing firm at either 47 or 50 percent. (It's a little unclear.) Derek Fisher says the union is "really not quite sure" whether owners are at 47 or 50. Billy Hunter said that David Stern "snookered" him and pulled the 50-50 offer that seemed to be on the table last week.
"Snookered" is your new lockout meme.
Several system issues, including the midlevel exception and the luxury tax, remain open. Fish says the union is fighting to preserve the right of taxpaying teams to use cap exceptions. As we talked about this morning, this one is critical for the Lakers.
The league will soon cancel all games through November 30. At this point, the 82-game season is basically dead.

In theory talks could resume this weekend, but Fish is flying back to Los Angeles tonight. On previous occasions when negotiations broke down, he stayed in New York so he could drop into a meeting at a moment's notice.

We now return you to your previously scheduled despair.

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feel bad for all those "video coordinators and scouts" teams have been hiring back in the past few days

ohh… jk… you’re fired. again.

Follow me: @theshmoes.

by theshmoes on Oct 28, 2011 2:58 PM PDT reply actions

this commercial is the nba lockout in a nutshell:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FaxgMY9_dWk

Follow me: @theshmoes.

by theshmoes on Oct 28, 2011 3:03 PM PDT reply actions

Yep. Someone needs to grab the wheel from Billy Hunter.

Let Steve Nash park this thing!

"Winning takes talent; to repeat takes character." - John Wooden

by Joshua S on Oct 28, 2011 5:53 PM PDT via mobile up reply actions

You're only a success for the moment that you complete a successful act. - Tex Winter
Tweetness

by SoCalGal on Oct 28, 2011 3:10 PM PDT reply actions 6 recs

yup!

Follow me: @theshmoes.

by theshmoes on Oct 28, 2011 3:21 PM PDT up reply actions

Stern about to talk here

http://www.nba.com/home/live1/

Twitter feed: @dexterfishmore

by DexterFishmore on Oct 28, 2011 3:12 PM PDT reply actions

Also hearing it'll be on ESPN

Twitter feed: @dexterfishmore

by DexterFishmore on Oct 28, 2011 3:15 PM PDT up reply actions

thanks for the link

Follow me: @theshmoes.

by theshmoes on Oct 28, 2011 3:20 PM PDT up reply actions

welp

Follow @Shaqfor3

by shaqfor3 on Oct 28, 2011 3:24 PM PDT reply actions 1 recs

Stern: there will not be an 82-game season

Twitter feed: @dexterfishmore

by DexterFishmore on Oct 28, 2011 3:29 PM PDT reply actions

So he's not just cancelling time. He's actually cancelling games.

That tweet didn’t make sense anyway. You can’t cancel time, you can only cancel an activity or event.

You're only a success for the moment that you complete a successful act. - Tex Winter
Tweetness

by SoCalGal on Oct 28, 2011 3:33 PM PDT up reply actions

Damn it

…

by Cup Noodles on Oct 28, 2011 3:31 PM PDT reply actions

Can someone explain to me

the purpose of a MLE if it cannot be used by teams paying luxury tax?

by LAMojo on Oct 28, 2011 4:02 PM PDT reply actions

The idea is

You could use it if you’re over the cap but under the tax line. Last year, for instance, the cap was $58 million but the tax didn’t kick in until $70.3 million. So it would be available to teams in that middle band, under the owners’ proposal.

Twitter feed: @dexterfishmore

by DexterFishmore on Oct 28, 2011 4:07 PM PDT up reply actions

Oh, I didn't realize there was that big a gap between the cap and the tax threshold.

Thanks for the info.

by LAMojo on Oct 28, 2011 4:27 PM PDT up reply actions

daaaaaaam it!!!!

"Hate me or love me. Its one or the other; always has been. Hate my game, my swagger. Hate my fadeaway, my hunger. Hate that I'm a veteran. A champion. Hate that. Hate it with all your heart. And hate that I'm loved for the exact same reasons." - Kobe Jelly Bean Bryant

by Jelly Bean on Oct 28, 2011 4:03 PM PDT reply actions

whoa!

"These are young men with too much money and too much fame for something as relatively inconsequential as sports, but this is entertainment." --Phil Jackson

by lakerdynasty on Oct 28, 2011 5:32 PM PDT up reply actions

.........nope

by AV. on Oct 28, 2011 4:14 PM PDT reply actions

so, the league position

is that they went back to their previously stated offer of 47%, which was their offer before they unoffically and then officially came up to 50/50 with no strings attached. Then, after going backwards to 47%, they come forward to 50% again. This apparently is what Stern was referencing by “economic movement”. And they sell this stuff, to the players and to the media and to us, with perfect aplomb. Asswipes.

Once again, it's much too late.

by Dave M.. on Oct 28, 2011 6:00 PM PDT reply actions

The players have practically no bargaining power in my opinion.

They’ve backed off the original deal, said they wouldn’t go past 53-54 and now they’re down to 52.75%. What’s to stop the owners from just waiting until they get down to an even 50%?

Affectionately,
Kareem Abdul-Jabbar,
NBA’s All-Time Leading Scorer

by afrikabamboodle on Oct 28, 2011 9:11 PM PDT reply actions

Why do you think this? Why does anyone think this?

I disagree. The Owners have a ton to lose. More. Years worth of losses for lost fans and sponsors…and the all-important upcoming TV deal. They can only lure the fans back on the backs on the stars they have right now. This isn’t the NFL, in which the sport is the thing.

In ‘99, there were 32 missed games from each teams schedule and the players walked away with 57% of the BRI, and the MLE’s, Bird Rights, etc. Without the star of Jordan. You tell me who won then. The players are in a better position than in ’99.

Silver Screen and Roll

Follow me on Twitter: @wondahbap

"open your eyes and brain then see in next five years from now will see what happen okay." - Nam Pham

by wondahbap on Oct 29, 2011 9:50 AM PDT up reply actions 1 recs

Isn't it evident in the way negotiations are going?

Only one side is showing that they are serious about compromising and the other side has stayed put. The players have slowly moved closer and closer to what the owners want yet the owners have not moved closer to meet the players. I don’t view compromise as a strength, I see it as a weakness. If the players continue to want to compromise and continue to get a less favorable deal, why would the owners suddenly decide to work something out? Why not just wait it out longer? Which side is more likely to cave first? The owners with hundreds of millions? Or the players where all the money lies with a very select star group? I think the owners know that there are players that are hurting without their checks.

Of course I’m just looking in from the outside but, if I was negotiating, and I see my opposition slowly backing down and slowly moving towards the deal that I want, I don’t suddenly just compromise after I’ve been so stubborn this entire time. I go for the kill.

Affectionately,
Kareem Abdul-Jabbar,
NBA’s All-Time Leading Scorer

by afrikabamboodle on Oct 29, 2011 7:50 PM PDT up reply actions

Compromise doesn't always mean weakness.

The owners have also given up many issues they were supposedly dead set on at first. Salary rollbacks, hard cap, 4 year max deals, Bird rights. The players have shown that there is a little to give and they have. If the owners were so strong and so willing to miss a season, then they would have cancelled the whole thing if they were serious. Instead, it’s threats and small chunks at a time. They know the players have a limit. They can’t afford to lose any more than the players because they (the owners) have “hundreds of millions” to lose. When the deal does get done, the players will get paid regardless. It’ll be the owners worries to recoup the lost revenue.

The NBA thinks they can afford to miss games because they know they have a crop of stars and good teams in the right cities that can carry the league. It’s not the players complaining about losing money, it’s the NBA. How much more will they let themselves lose by missing games? The players know this too. They won in ‘99, and I expect them to ultimately win this time. The NBA has a breaking point. They’re the ones with budgets to meet, payrolls to make, and sponsors to please. Players? Themselves and families. If some can’t afford to miss a half season’s worth of checks, then they’re casualties of war. The NBPA prepared them for this. Basketball WILL be back. That’s a given.

Silver Screen and Roll

Follow me on Twitter: @wondahbap

"open your eyes and brain then see in next five years from now will see what happen okay." - Nam Pham

by wondahbap on Oct 30, 2011 10:23 AM PDT up reply actions

I need to stop reading lockout news...

The only time it gets me down is when the news media raises my hopes for a day, and then squashes it…. and it seems like the media likes to raise all our hopes at least once a week….

by neokoros on Oct 28, 2011 9:15 PM PDT reply actions