Trevor Ariza and Ron Artest — The View from Houston...
Wow... I can't pretend to be pleased about this switch of 3s. Trevor Ariza was my second favorite Laker from the 2008-09 World Championship team (Pau being my pal, and yes, I do realize who else suited up for them). Pure hustle, defensive energy, and timely shooting... As for Artest? Well, let's just say that he's already an award winner with me, named as he was to my first annual All-NBA All Moron Squad. (Yeah, I know it's not a very catchy name. There are other metaphorically descriptive nouns for Ron-Ron and his ilk that better apply and I would most assuredly have come up with a more fittingly offensive moniker, 'cept Rev. Dave of Blazers Edge —where the list was posted in early April — has rather draconian rules against such things...) More follows after the jump, so click it, baby!
I averted my eyes for a day or two going on vacation to Northern California and returned to learn that Mitch Kupchak and Daryl Morey had each managed to come to terms with the other's Unrestricted Free Agent Small Forward. That's some fast negotiating, guys... You've seen the deals and I've seen the deals: Trevor Ariza to the Rockets, Ron "Crazy Pills" Artest to the Lakers for Mid-Level Exception money — Trevor landing a 5 year deal and LAL stepping up to the plate for 3 years of Ron.
Here's what I had to say about Crazy Ron 3 months ago: "At only $7.4 Million this season, he’s a veritable bargain. That’s because he’s already been marked down for being seriously damaged… I like his toughness and still manage to hate every single thing about his game. He’s ironically both a gunner and a loose cannon that will end up sinking the ship (that’s some kind of a daily double!), we can only hope that this happens sooner rather than later..."
That's pretty much on the money, I think, and the only thing I would now revise is that I henceforth hope he DOESN'T end up sinking the ship with his serial weirdnesses, existential chemistry poisoning, near comical ball hoggery, and horrid shot selection.
If I were a big fat fatty owner of an NBA franchise, hoppin' around the clubs with delectable 18 year old hotties and looking to unload a couple wheelbarrows full of greenies on a $33M Free Agent, I certainly know where I'd be dumping my dosh. I'd dish out to the standout defender, the playoff proven role-player from UCLA rather than the ummmm, colorful man with bad hair from the mean streets.
But done's done and there is no sense crying over the deal at this point, even if I do feel like crying a little...
Anyway I was curious how this de facto trade has been playing in Rocketland and decided to take a little spin around the old neighborhood for a sampling of the views of beat journalists, bloggers, and fans alike.
First, let's put the Ariza signing into context...
(1)
While Yao, the Rockets' "Cornerstone" Considers Options, the Rockets have Few
by Jonathan Feigen, Houston Chronicle Rockets blog
So the Rockets wait. Again.
Rockets physician Tom Clanton revealed on Monday that the hairline fracture in Yao Ming's left foot not only has failed to heal as expected but has gotten worse. The treatments could be as simple as putting him back in a boot or in a cast, to an extensive surgery to alter the operation of his foot. He could miss much of the summer or all of next season. If the most extensive surgery is necessary and did not go well, the injury could be career-threatening.
First, a glimmer of hope.
When I asked Clanton if the possibility that Yao's hairline fracture could still heal on its own — as the doctors always thought it would — would be something along the lines of me winning the lottery, he jumped in before I could finish the sentence.
"Oh, no, no," he said. "I would not put it that way.
"The fact he is having no symptoms gives us reason for optimism."
Yao could choose to immobilize the foot again, and he would be thrilled if instead of the eight weeks the Rockets thought it would take for the bone to heal, it took 16, or 24.
Still, it feels as if that is hoping for a long, long shot to come through. * * *
"The hairline fracture that is present in the previous X-rays shows evidence it has not healed and has extended across the bone," Clanton said.
That is enough to force Yao and the Rockets to consider far more extreme steps than putting him back in the boot or in a cast and him drink oil tankers of whole milk.
There is a wide range of surgical options. * * *
"At this point, the injury has the potential for him missing this next season and could be career threatening," Clanton said. "One of the things we are trying to get is a consensus opinion on that, to make certain there is no option we are overlooking that would provide an earlier return or would be an option for treatment that he would prefer rather than d oing additional surgery." * * *
(2) Swapping with L.A.: Artest going, Ariza Coming: Forward Ariza agrees in principle to 5-year deal by Jonathan Feigen, Houston Chronicle While Ron Artest headed to Los Angeles and a chance to win a championship, Trevor Ariza, the small forward with a key hand in the most recent title run, agreed to join the Rockets to replace him. Ariza accepted the Rockets' offer of a five-year, mid-level exception deal late Thursday, expected to be worth roughly $33 million, an individual with knowledge of the deal said. Players may sign free agent contracts beginning July 8. The Lakers on Wednesday offered Ariza, 24, a contract similar to the mid-level exception he accepted from the Rockets, but well short of the deal he reportedly was seeking. Ariza, a 6-8 forward, averaged 8.9 points and 4.3 rebounds last season, his fifth season after one season at UCLA. Though long a top-level small forward athletically, Ariza's stock shot up as his shooting range and touch improved. He averaged 11.3 points in the playoffs, making 49.7 of his shots and 47.6 percent of his 3-pointers, making several game-changing defensive plays during the Lakers' Western Conference Finals series with the Nuggets. Ariza, chosen by the New York Knicks in the second round of the 2004 NBA Draft, was traded to the Orlando Magic for former Rockets guard Steve Francis, and to the Lakers for current Rockets forward Brian Cook, starting 20 games in the regular-season this season but all 23 of the Lakers' post-season games. After Ariza turned down the Lakers' contract offer on Wednesday, Artest quickly grabbed it Thursday afternoon, going from spending much of the post-season playing against the Lakers or watching them from courtside at Staples Center to joining them. With the Rockets looking elsewhere, Artest had considered overtures from the Cavaliers before choosing Thursday to join the Lakers, the team that eliminated the Rockets in seven games in the Western Conference semifinals. Artest accepted a three-year, mid-level deal in Los Angeles, where he has spent much of the off-season and had received recruiting efforts from former AAU teammate Lamar Odom. * * *
(3) Rockets' Exchange Likely for the Better by Richard Justice, Houston Chronicle Trevor Ariza makes the Rockets younger, faster and better. He fits with the way Rick Adelman wants to play. Sometime next season, we're going to see Tracy McGrady, Carl Landry, Aaron Brooks and Ariza leading a fast break that will take your breath away. Finally, we're going to have an Adelman team that plays like an Adelman team. I'm so giddy about Ariza that I'm willing to forgive and forget with T-Mac. OK, so we're getting ahead of ourselves. Let's take a deep breath and go one step at a time. Ariza is a first-rate defensive player, threw in almost 50 percent of his 3-pointers in the playoffs, and is still only 24. Yes, there's still that hole at center. Give Daryl Morey a couple more days to take care of that issue. Maybe you've heard Ariza wasn't Morey's first choice. You would be right about that. In fact, I'm guessing Morey took a flyer on Ariza, never figuring he had a chance to land him.
Ariza told the Lakers and other teams it wasn't going to be about the money, but that's what people say. He apparently meant it, however; one source estimates he left $9 million on the table to join the Rockets. * * *
(4)
I'm Going to Miss You, Crazy Pills
by Grunge Dave, The Dream Shake (SBN)
Dear RonRon,
I'm gonna miss you. I admit, I'm a little weepy right now. You were everything we asked for when we traded Donte Greene and a draft pick to get you last summer. We always knew it might be a short-term relationship given that you were in a contract year. We didn't care. Nor do I feel cheated today. It was worth the risk. And I fully believe that risk paid off in spades.
You helped get the Rockets to the second round this year. Which for Yao Ming and others had to seem like a myth until they actually got there. (Tracy McGrady... still a non-believer.) You brought an aggressiveness and a mindset to Houston that had been lacking for more than a decade. No one bullies the Rockets anymore.
So, thank you, Ron Artest. I truly mean it.
I do not begrudge you in your decision to join Kobe and the Lakers. It makes perfect sense. Yao and T-Mac probably won't be suiting up in 2010. The Rockets are rebuilding, whether they want to admit it publicly or not. I'm okay with all of this. Which is why I understand that you had to do what is best for you, Ron. I absolutely do understand. And I wish you nothing but the best in Los Angeles. * * *
(5)
Thoughts about the Artest-Ariza Swapout
by John, Club Yao
So Ron Artest is gone and Trevor Ariza is coming to Houston. I'm okay with that.
Ariza reminds me of a more athletic Robert Horry, and we all know how he helped the Rockets win a couple of rings. Both have shown they can hit big shots in the clutch, something the Rockets have needed.
If it turns out Yao is going to be hurt for all of next season, then the Rockets can't build around Artest. He's not a cornerstone player, and he's not getting any younger. And as much as I liked him as a player, I was very disappointed how he never learned how to stop being a ballhog and jack up terrible shots. He is what he is.
Although Artest is going to sign for the mid-level exception with the Lakers for around $5-$6 million per year for 3 years, he would have cost a lot more to the Rockets (maybe $9 million/year for 3 years, if not more).
The Rockets can't tie up that kind of money for an offensive liability as they try to retool for the future. Not for a 40% shooter. I actually think Artest is going to disrupt the offensive chemistry on the Lakers...but that's their problem. Regardless, it will be interesting to see how it all plays out in LA-LA land. * * *
(6)
July 3rd Houston Sports FaF Smear (and WTF)
by THE Random Guy, Fourth and Fifty.com
Let me explain how my brain works (or in this case "doesn't work") from a day to day stand point. I met some friends up at Cedar Creek in the Heights, so the obvious disclaimer here is that liquid inebriants were involved. Still, what follows is a bit of dumbassery.
I'm was barely paying attention to the Women's Wimbledon Semi-Finals. Elena Dementieva seemed to have complete control over Serena Williams. Every time I looked up it seemed like Serena was hobbling up and down the baseline, beaten in spirit, will and on the scoreboard. Even though they were trading games in the final set I assumed it obvious that Dementieva would be the eventual winner. As they walked off the court it seemed that was the result.
Sometime during that scintillating match, right after Serena was done bouncing her boobies for ESPN after winning a point, a game-break occured announcing that Ron Artest had signed a three-year deal. SWEET! A three-year deal! That means that he has some inside information and Yao Ming is going to be back, everything is going to be perfect and we're all going to be one big happy family.
Well, guess what? Serena Williams will be part of another all-Williams sister major final. And, (more importantly) Ron Artest didn't sign a three year deal with the Rockets... HE SIGNED WITH THE LOS ANGELES LAKERS!! He announced it live on SportsCenter! He didn't Tweet about it, let his agent actually finalize the deal, or allow the team to announce in a press conference. He circumvented everything and showed up in Bristol with a "So Gutta" hat on to announce his move. Ridiculous.
The overall question is "why?" Why would you do this Ron-Ron? Lakers, are you serious? This move makes no sense for you. Daryl Morey, what are you going to do about it? Oh, you're going to sign Trevor Ariza? Ok, I guess I can live with that. * * *
(7)
I'm Happy About These Transactions
posted by "Sherlock" to Clutch Fans message board
I like being the underdogs ... and glad Ariza is on board.
Artest is probably in a better place too, and with Yao and TMac out, will probably get his ring there sooner. I personally liked Artest here, and thought he brought some toughness we needed, gave us flexibility, and an asset on both sides of the ball, which is hard to find. I love how much he loved Houston, too, and was proud of him being here. Of course, he probably brought drama behind the scenes that made things more challenging for the coaches, the ball would stop with him sometimes, and he really didn't play all that well in stretches. But, he was a signficant asset here, IMHO, and I actually hoped we'd keep him, if nothing else, as a player asset.
I'd have liked to get something back for Artest, but, it wouldn't surprise me if there wasn't some backroom stuff going on where Houston and LA let each other "have" the other player through MLEs. Artest would have been insulted and developed an attitude if HOU had offered him the same deal he's excited about getting in LA. Ariza was insulted by the same deal from LA, that he's excited about from HOU. Sometimes, people have to switch teams, and this is a good example of everyone winning. Both teams got happy players cheaper.
I'm happy about these transactions. Ariza has some serious upside, and we just got younger, with less health concerns, and with less drama, and greater flexibility for other trades this off-season. * * *
(8)
posted by "Alethios" to Clutch Fans message board
* * *
I would love nothing more than to see Fakers self-destruct with their new dramatic addition.I imagine that Jerry Buss will be pleading with Jackson to coach full-time so he can keep some control over the Ron-ron's quirks.
You know, Ariza is a role player and damn good at it, but we're definitely in a rebuilding year without Yao and Tracy. If we had both healthy (I forgot what that looks like), this Ariza deal would make perfect sense.
But we have to believe in Rockets management to make the right decisions even if that's accepting a tank year to get us to a trade-worthy year (2010) and get some real star power for this team again. * * *
(9)
Ariza More Cool-Headed, Controlled, Team-Oriented
posted by "Mazinger" to Clutch Fans message board
Let's clear some things first.
First of all, people were saying Ron was better than Tracy becasue everyone was pissed and still are at him. Ron is not better than Tracy [McGrady].
Secondly, Ron did not get us to the 2nd round, it was the hard work of every single player. If anything, Ron hurt the Rockets more than helped. He often did not play the Rockets offence and forced several shots and tried to win a game by himself which turned into a loss. Defense, yes, maybe against some players but Battier ended guarding Roy and Kobe most of the time becasue they were both tearing Ron to pieces.
The Rockets could have easily offered Ron more years but something had to have happened for both Rick and Morey not to have extended such offer and instead go for Ariza. In Ariza we have a more cool headed, controlled, and team player who is not going to try to win or lose a game by himself. That is why Rick and Morey decided to go for Ariza than Ron besides age.
The reason why people are saying Ron is not a good fit with the Lakers is because they have too many people who demand the ball: Kobe, Gasol, Odem and now Ron. There is going to be some conflicts there as to who will be taking the shots and when. Just look at teams who have had too many stars:
The Lakers when they had Karl Malone, Gary Payton, Kobe, and Shaq did not win a Championship. * * *
The Bottom Line:
1. T-Mac is in the middle of microfracture, Yao with another dreaded stress-fracture in his foot — and both of them are in contract years. The time to rebuild is now.
2. Given that, who would our Rockets be better suited to build around — a defensive-minded role player or an aging prima dona shooter with an overstated reputation for defense?
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Comments
The Lakers did not win the title in 2004 because Karl Malone got injured, not because of lack of team chemistry
The Lakers’ “chemistry” was fine. Karl Malone’s knee was not.
"This is not a game for boys. This is a game for men." - Phil Jackson
by Gils_Keloids on Jul 3, 2009 3:19 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Wake me up
This still has to be a nightmare, right?
TA can’t be gone.
Control yourself
Take only what you need from it
by PeanutButterSpread on Jul 3, 2009 3:28 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
It makes no sense at all...
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
by timbo on Jul 3, 2009 3:30 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
David Lee f*cked this up.
we could have gotten TA, LO and SB all back … but no … he had to be an ass to management.
Control yourself
Take only what you need from it
by PeanutButterSpread on Jul 3, 2009 3:39 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
it makes perfect sense. the lakers offered ariza the MLE and he wanted more than that. thus, mitch made a wise business decision by going with plan b, signing artest for about the same amount. artest took it in a heartbeat.
by chaucer on Jul 3, 2009 5:07 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
David Lee f*cked this up.
we could have gotten TA, LO and SB all back … but no …
Control yourself
Take only what you need from it
by PeanutButterSpread on Jul 3, 2009 3:38 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
It still has not happened
Whenever someone takes the stance of questioning the Lakers reasons for signing Artest the onus is only placed on the Mitch and ownership. Timbo I read your comments and there is no mention of Ariza’s agent. No mention about him being told by his own admition that he was offered the MLE and was told to come back if he gets a better offer so that the Lakers can match it or attempt to do so. That is how business is done. There is no mention of David Lee’s comments of not wanting to speak to the Lakers again after they offered the MLE to give them an opportunity to match any offers. I still don’t understand how someone who is an obvious basketball fan can be surprised considering that the facts are all over the internet.
by PURPLE AND GOLD FOR LIFE on Jul 3, 2009 3:40 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
I think from Houston's perspective ...
they think LA shafted TA.
But in reality, Lee shafted both LA and TA by being an a-hole.
Seriously, I love TA, I wish him the best, but he had a promising and bright future with the Lakers, but his agent screwed it up for him. I normally don’t agree with most of Adrian Woj’s articles, but TA is at best, a Michael Cooper type role player, and if he’s on a championship caliber team, he’ll shine … but for a lottery bounded team? No. and that’s really unfortunate.
TA’s loss has hit my harder than Ronny’s loss.
I don’t think I’ll ever get over it until the regular season starts and even then, I don’t think it’ll be the same with opening intros and TA’s not in sight.
I just bought a LA team shirt with TA, LO, Kobe, D-Fish and Pau on it. I’m probably going to wear it all summer long as a tribute to TA.
Control yourself
Take only what you need from it
by PeanutButterSpread on Jul 3, 2009 3:45 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Losing TA was tough
The best analysis I heard was that the Lakers current championship roster was flawless. Now with Artest they risk losing that. But it is a risk that Laker fans are willing to take.
by PURPLE AND GOLD FOR LIFE on Jul 3, 2009 9:18 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
every basketball analyst is saying ariza made a mistake by letting his agent misguide him. lee seriously wanted 50 million dollars? what a joke! ariza is dumb, he should have accepted the lakers’ offer in the first place. u have to wonder how much did he really want to stay with the team, if he allegedly got offended by an offer which he ultimately agreed to with another team.
by chaucer on Jul 3, 2009 5:09 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Is there anyway we can trade to get Ariza back lol?
Control yourself
Take only what you need from it
by PeanutButterSpread on Jul 3, 2009 3:40 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Seriously. Luke for TA. Sound fair.
Control yourself
Take only what you need from it
by PeanutButterSpread on Jul 3, 2009 3:45 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Only if it was that easy. Luke and his dang contract. He gets paid (basically) the MLE amount AND his contract goes all the way up until 2013…
by intuitive on Jul 3, 2009 3:48 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
LOL I only wish we could trade Luke for TA.
There’s no one on the planet that would want Luke and his bad contract.
well … maybe Memphis?
but I shouldn’t rag on them, they did trade Pau to us.
Maybe the Clippers would want Luke.
Control yourself
Take only what you need from it
by PeanutButterSpread on Jul 3, 2009 4:19 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Nah I think Clippers are going for the whole 2010 thing.I dont think ANY team would take on Luke’s contract unless we threw in one of our good guys (Lamar, Pau, Bynum) which is not worth it. If only we could get rid of both Luke and Sasha’s contracts…
by intuitive on Jul 3, 2009 4:23 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
besides i think we couldn’t have just sat put, while everyone else was loading new ammunition. artest will bring an intensity and ferocity that no one else on this team can bring, not even ariza. if only he can rub some of that attitude on bynum—he’s the one that needs to get nasty, more than anyone else.
by chaucer on Jul 3, 2009 5:12 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Oh yeah and what's the deal with Lamar?
How come we haven’t heard anything from his side or from the Front Office on negotiations with his deal?
Control yourself
Take only what you need from it
by PeanutButterSpread on Jul 3, 2009 3:41 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Timbo, I’m guessing you didn’t read this article.
http://www.hoopsworld.com/Story.asp?story_id=13174
Ariza was Plan A: With the Los Angeles Laker boldly agreeing to terms with forward Ron Artest, General Manager Mitch Kupchak has landed a player the team has been itching to acquire since he was in Indiana.
The cost was the well-liked Trevor Ariza, who has agreed to sign an MLE deal with the Houston Rockets (~$32.3 million).
A source tells HOOPSWORLD that Kupchak was prepared to give Ariza an offer equivalent to the full MLE but at 10.5% raises, totaling at approximately $33.8 million over five years.
LA’s ceiling might have been a $6 million starting salary for $36 million over five but before negotiations progressed after 9:00pm Pacific on Tuesday night, the source says that Ariza’s agent, David Lee, took a confrontational approach with Kupchak.
Lee wanted a deal in the $50 million range and took offense to the team’s stance that Trevor should test the market first for that level of compensation.
By the next morning, the Lakers were going after Artest in full force with Kobe Bryant, Lamar Odom and even Magic Johnson reaching out to the Houston forward.
LA was acknowledging privately that Ariza was going down the path of Ronny Turiaf, a player the team had great affection for and wanted to keep but couldn’t because of economics.
Ariza’s agent ended up settling for significantly less money with the Rockets, at least based on the expectations he presented to Kupchak.
By getting a raise greater than 20% (he earned $3.1 million last season), Ariza’s contract has Base Year Compensation (BYC) status which is a technical term that indicates he’s difficult to trade. Should the Lakers and Rockets want to do a dual sign and trade with Ariza and Artest, Trevor being BYC makes that extremely difficult and quite unlikely.
While letting Trevor Ariza go was a difficult decision for the team, Kupchak reacted quickly. Taking advantage of Houston’s misfortune with Yao Ming’s foot injury possibly taking him out for an entire year, the Laker GM quickly turned to Plan B.
Basically the Lakers could have offered Ariza MORE than the contract he accepted in Houston, but because of his agent’s insistence that Trevor was worth more Mitch went and pursued Artest.
Because of his agent Trevor signs with a team that isn’t a title contender (not right now at least) and to top it off he gets paid less. (About 1.5 million less through the duration of the contract) His agent fucked him over.
by intuitive on Jul 3, 2009 3:47 PM PDT reply actions 3 recs
Factor cost of living and state income taxes into that equation, and then tell me where he’s getting paid more.
by seanbergmanrules on Jul 3, 2009 6:05 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
But factor in all the money he gets paid in LA to show up for signings or hosting events, and being in contention for a title…
And Trevor’s lived here since he was in high school, I’m sure he is already familiar with living and taxes in LA.
by intuitive on Jul 3, 2009 6:09 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Just a question here… Can players take up residency in a state other than the one they are playing in and thusly pay all or a portion of their state income tax in that other state?
vr, Xei
by Xeifrank on Jul 4, 2009 9:36 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Income tax is payable in the state in which it is earned, as far as I am aware.
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
by timbo on Jul 4, 2009 10:25 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
For professional sports athletes and people who hold concerts, they end up paying state taxes where they “earn it”. NBA players pay state taxes in every state where they had a road game. It gets pretty complicated. So Trevor would split up his income tax to the various states.
by disgruntleduser on Jul 4, 2009 10:44 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Nice find intuitive.
I am not surprised the agent messed this one up. Whenever there are problems in negotiations, signs tend to point to the agent.
GO BRONCOS IN 2009 AND BEYOND!!
2009 NBA Champions L.A Lakers
2009 NBA Finals MVP Kobe Bryant
by weazel on Jul 3, 2009 6:28 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
David Lee
has just gained the type of reputation that no one in his field would like to have. As I said before he is only thinking of his commission.
by PURPLE AND GOLD FOR LIFE on Jul 3, 2009 8:01 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Ariza/Artest
I have to agree with the sentiment about Lee screwing over Ariza. Right now it looks like the Rockets are on the way down the NBA hierarchy, moving into a restructuring phase…again. Will Ariza help in that? Definitely. But the people thinking this is somehow going to destroy the Lakers are simply…flat out wrong. If anything this move will help ensure that between Kobe and Artest. No complacency as champions last year creeps in to the next season.
by ButTheCatCameBack on Jul 3, 2009 3:51 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
You speak the truth.
Artest’s resume of playoff success far outweighs TMAC.
Artest’s competitive nature far outweighs Lamar and Ariza… combined.
by SimpleTruth on Jul 3, 2009 8:27 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Let the David Lee hunt begin!
What’s the bet that right now, there’s a lot of pissed off Lakers fans that wouldn’t mind meeting David Lee and tearing into him?
He’s going to have to hide from LA for a while … at least until AB’s next contract talks, that is if Lee’s still his agent by then.
Word of advice to AB, kick Lee to the curb before he screws you over.
Control yourself
Take only what you need from it
by PeanutButterSpread on Jul 3, 2009 4:18 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Bonzi Well's Agent
Apparently David Lee was also Bonzi Well’s agent, who turned down Sacramento’s multi-year contract offer in 2006, only for Bonzi to be forced to accept Houston’s two year $5 million deal. Maybe David Lee is really Darryl Morey’s friend or something?
by grimmz on Jul 3, 2009 5:09 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
did u see that picture of david lee that was posted on here yesterday? lol
by chaucer on Jul 3, 2009 5:28 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
i wonder how the lakers will deal with lee when bynum’s contract expires.
by chaucer on Jul 3, 2009 5:14 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Hopefully Bynum will see the writing on the wall before it gets to that point
and find himself a better agent.
by Darkemans on Jul 3, 2009 5:51 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
i am not happy about pao gasol’s decision to play for spain in the euros…he got hurt playing for spain while under contract with memphis. i am afraid it might happen again, and hurt our chances of repeating.
by chaucer on Jul 3, 2009 5:16 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
i did love how ariza would steal the ball and intercept passes. that was awesome.
by chaucer on Jul 3, 2009 5:24 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
kobe or bynum should have
taken ariza to the playboy mansion immediately after winning the title, so he wouldn’t claim that he felt unappreciated. damn, hefner!
by chaucer on Jul 3, 2009 5:27 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
I will root for Ariza in pre-game intros
And boo him as soon as he scores a point, makes a steal, draws a charge, or blocks a shot.
"This is not a game for boys. This is a game for men." - Phil Jackson
by Gils_Keloids on Jul 3, 2009 5:44 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
I can’t even imagine him in a different team’s jersey next season.
by intuitive on Jul 3, 2009 6:10 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Once the Laker uniform comes off
it all changes. Do I appreciate him? Yes. Will I root for any player that is not a Laker? NEVER!
by PURPLE AND GOLD FOR LIFE on Jul 3, 2009 8:03 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Trevor's a big boy
What has transpired is Trevor’s doing, and only Trevor’s. He is not a victim. He made a choice. While I would have loved to see him in a Laker uniform, his business takes him elsewhere. Good Luck Trevor, my fellow Bruin. Now I want to see how good this Artest dude is on defense. And rest assured there is only one Alpha-Male in this pack and that;s Kobe. Now join me in a collective call in saying Fuck the Celtics.
by Jello Is Jiggling on Jul 3, 2009 6:22 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
I still can't believe why he would want to leave a championship team.
GO BRONCOS IN 2009 AND BEYOND!!
2009 NBA Champions L.A Lakers
2009 NBA Finals MVP Kobe Bryant
by weazel on Jul 3, 2009 6:35 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Mitch's hand was forced.
TA’s agent basically forced Mitch to go with Artest. If Lee did get confrontational, that would’ve indicated to Mitch that a resolution was not a sure thing. When Artest lays down the gift he does, if Mitch hesitates Artest may move on to Cleveland or whoever. If a deal with Ariza doesn’t get done then the Lakers get stuck with no one. Artest for three years at the MLE is the same value as TA for five years at the MLE. Mitch went with the sure thing. Trevor’s agent practically left no other safe play.
by Pants on Fire on Jul 3, 2009 7:09 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
I completely agree! If TA left for Houston & Artest to Cle. then the Lakers would have a big hole in their starting lineup plus a stronger Cavs team.
The Artest move is a bit risky but the best choice available. (I personally don’t like him much but Kobe & Lamar do. Hope he and Lamar don’t pull too many all-nighters in Hollywood.)
by lazNirv on Jul 4, 2009 11:05 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'M WITH PLASHKE ON THIS ONE
No matter what caused it, Ariza was a better fit on this team. It’s hard to understand why Ariza would make the decision to leave, if it’s true that he would have been paid more in LA.
Artest will try to show off his offensive “skills” to the detriment of the rest of the team, and will quickly become sullen if benched for it.
Phil will have quite an adjustment to make between Ariza and Artest.
by nba is the worst on Jul 3, 2009 7:12 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
“Phil will have quite an adjustment to make between Ariza and Artest”
Uh, I think he did that with a guy named Dennis Rodman. and he may have won a few titles with him as well but correct me if i’m wrong
by Dodger16 on Jul 3, 2009 11:55 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
hmmm… Dennis Rodman? wasn’t she married to charlie sheen?
by _logan_ on Jul 4, 2009 12:00 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Why do people focus on the off-court stuff?
Yeah, Artest and Rodman were both crazy off the court. On the court, they’re different. At least on the offensive end.
Rodman didn’t take shots away from MJ or Pippen. If anything, he created more shots for others with his offensive rebounding. Artest, like Dwyer, Pelton, Kurt Helin, and many extremely intelligent basketball minds have said, is a gunner.
So yes, Phil does have an adjustment to make on the offensive end. He’s going from a spot up shooter to a gunner with poor shot selection. That takes adjustment, and has nothing to do with Artest’s similarities off the court to Rodman.
by Snoopy2006 on Jul 4, 2009 12:30 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
The Laker System
Ron Artest knows he is not the top dog in the Laker System. He shall follow Kobe and Phil and he shall play a role to win… as evidenced by taking a lesser salary.
Sacramento and Indiana post Ron? Not so good. Ron has even beaten Tracy by making it to the second round and took the Lakers to 7 games. He knows how to win.
He is smarter than he is given credit for (due to his competitive nature) he shall learn the triangle, he will learn his role. Playing with Kobe and Gasol will up his percentages just like Ariza’s.
Unlike Ariza who needed to make clutch plays for the Lakers, Ron Artest will be the defensive player who will make sure that clutch plays will not be necessary by playing hard for 36 minutes a game. Remember, Ron Artest was able to beat Lebron James this year.
by SimpleTruth on Jul 3, 2009 7:56 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
so now that hedo backed down from the blazers’ offer will portland pursue odom? will they offer him the entire 9 million of space they have?
by chaucer on Jul 3, 2009 7:58 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Good point!
I think that is a strong possibility. But honestly, LO is not worth that much and Turk was waaay better offensively for LO to be considered for that type of money. But the Lakers might give it to him to keep him.
by PURPLE AND GOLD FOR LIFE on Jul 3, 2009 8:05 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
LO: a 3 or a 4?
Lamar is more of a 4 than he is a 3. Portland has LaMarcus, Pryzbilla, Oden and currently Frye. LO does not fit with Portland unless Frye leaves, Pryzbilla plays less and Oden does not develop.
If anything… Portland will use that 9 and acquire Andre Miller.
But of course… who knows.. we’re not GMs.
by SimpleTruth on Jul 3, 2009 8:31 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
He's gone — KP is not going to tender him a qualifying offer...
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
by timbo on Jul 3, 2009 9:30 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
odom is a natural small forward. allegedly his decrease in speed and quickness have caused him to play more 4. he’s good at either one. he’s probably more of a pf nowadays.
by chaucer on Jul 3, 2009 11:42 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
He was a PF last year, anyways...
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
by timbo on Jul 4, 2009 10:27 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Was just in the elevator at Caesars with Trevor Ariza…straight from his mouth – “they didn’t offer me shit and signed Ron Artest” whoaaa
I think Ariza really took it to heart that Mitch didn’t make him an initial offer (instead telling him to go out into the open market, find an offer and he might match it) Dang. :(
by intuitive on Jul 3, 2009 8:13 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
i could have sworn that the first words were that...
the Lakers offered MLE, David Lee called it a slap in the face.
The greatest trick the devil ever pulled was convincing the world he didn't exist.
by Justin N. on Jul 3, 2009 8:16 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Maybe Mitch didn’t actually offer it to him, and just told his agent that he WOULD give him the MLE. In reports they were saying that Mitch didn’t actually offer anything and instead he told him to go out and find offers and he might match it.. Which hints at the fact that maybe Ariza really wasn’t offered anything….. Then his agent talked to all those journalists/ESPN saying all those things…
So then during that time, before Ariza could even go back to show his offers, Mitch decided that Ariza probably wasn’t going to come back. Then he just signed Artest.
Does that make sense?
by intuitive on Jul 3, 2009 8:27 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
No. His agent should have been much more clear with the media if thats the case.
The greatest trick the devil ever pulled was convincing the world he didn't exist.
by Justin N. on Jul 3, 2009 9:01 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I agree. It was partly Mitch’s fault for not coming out and just offering the MLE (instead saying that he was GOING to offer it to him) then Ariza’s agent is at fault for releasing all that information to the media instead of just waiting it out. What stinks is that in the midst of all this, Ariza’s the one that gets burned.
by intuitive on Jul 3, 2009 9:16 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
the whole thing falls on David Lee. as an agent, he should have communicated better with his client (TA) and the negotiating partner (Laker Management) and he failed at the simple part of his job. this guy shouldn’t have anymore clients. what an IDIOT
by Dodger16 on Jul 3, 2009 11:59 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
all this hatred against lee. we have no idea what he looks like
by chaucer on Jul 4, 2009 12:00 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
He's the guy on the left.

"I've hacked into your brain. You're throwing a party and no one's showing up."
by ignign*kt on Jul 4, 2009 12:40 AM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
Let me guess................... the guy on the right is Jerry Buss?
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
by timbo on Jul 4, 2009 10:27 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
No one knows for sure
Even if it comes from Ariza it was his agent that was negotiating with the Lakers. If those are his exact words then it sounds to me like he took it personal. What I want to know is when did his agent go to the Lakers with any offer and gave the Lakers the chance to counter?
by PURPLE AND GOLD FOR LIFE on Jul 3, 2009 9:51 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well the Lakers didn’t really give Ariza’s agent time to counter the offer. Right after they got done meeting with Ariza the next day Artest verbally committed. What’s interesting is right after the meeting the agent talked with the media saying that probably nothing is going to happen because Mitch didn’t even sound interested etc. So was he bluffing and did it backfire? or Did Mitch rush to sign Artest? I mean no one really knows at this point
by intuitive on Jul 3, 2009 10:09 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
good point but..
..let’s say the Lakers wait for Ariza’s offer and they loose out on either won. Would you be happy with Luke at that position or would you sign Artest not knowing if Ariza’s agent was bluffing? what would you do? what if Ariza signed with the cavs or magic?
by PURPLE AND GOLD FOR LIFE on Jul 3, 2009 11:43 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I know what you mean. Thats why I’m saying that his agent screwed up and Mitch didn’t help the cause. Therefore Ariza got screwed over.
Ariza could have decided to sign with the Cavs. The Cavs offered him the full MLE and the whole 5 year deal. Same exact contract Houston offered him and he chose Houston over Cleveland.
by intuitive on Jul 4, 2009 12:06 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
who was in the elevator with trevOR??? YOU?
by chaucer on Jul 4, 2009 12:07 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I know and I’m pretty sure they have a pretty good small forward in Cleveland.
by intuitive on Jul 4, 2009 12:17 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
and the weather
is horrible in cleveland :p.
by Nostance on Jul 4, 2009 1:02 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
i read david lee wanted 50 million from the lakers
by chaucer on Jul 3, 2009 11:51 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
who was in the elevator with trevOR??? YOU?
by chaucer on Jul 3, 2009 11:50 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
No its on Twitter, and he was at Caesar’s today. He’s been in Vegas for a few days now (that’s where he met with Houston’s GM too)
by intuitive on Jul 4, 2009 12:07 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I hate to lose trevor
but if the Lakers lose both trevor and LO, Artest is the one free agent available that can fill both of their shoes. Although maybe at not the same level. IF (big if) Artest can remain mentally stable, not try to gun the ball at inopportune moments and fill the role the Lakers need him for, the Lakers may be even better next year. Trevor would have been a better long term investment and I think it’s not too early to think about the post Kobe Lakers.
by keefer on Jul 3, 2009 9:10 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
The Lakers are not losing LO
If they were then why would the Lakers use LO to woo Artest. He was one of the Lakers involved in talking to Artest to get him to come to LA. The Lakers went as far as talking to Artest’s wife.
by PURPLE AND GOLD FOR LIFE on Jul 3, 2009 9:20 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Part of bringing Artest in is to keep Odom
LO and Artest are Queens buddies. And our window is basically set for the next three years. Kobe isn’t getting younger. This was a good move for the now.
by Ben R on Jul 3, 2009 9:56 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Exactly which is why Ariza's 24 years of age is meaningless.
by PURPLE AND GOLD FOR LIFE on Jul 3, 2009 10:37 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well, it's not meaningless
Long-term building blocks are always a good thing. You can never thing too far ahead. But for the moment, we made the right deal.
by Ben R on Jul 3, 2009 10:59 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
the Artest acquisition is Brilliant
You all just don’t get it. Ariza is not strong enough to guard Lebron, Melo, Carter, or Pierce. These forwards and their teams are the main threats to the Lakers next year and Artest can shut these superstars down. Kobe doesn’t have to waste his stamina on these guys any more. He has an enforcer now.
by fadi on Jul 3, 2009 10:30 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
The best argument for Artest
Period. Practically every contender has a superstar wing: Boston (Pierce), Cleveland (LeBron), Orlando (Carter), Denver (Melo), San Antonio (Jefferson/Ginobli), Portland (Roy). Artest is a fantastic matchup for all of them and takes pressure off Kobe.
by Ben R on Jul 3, 2009 11:01 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
The one thing. . .
I agree about Artest being better on LeBron, Melo, Pierce types. But the one thing Trevor could do that Artest can’t is hound quick point guards a la Tony Parker, Chris Paul, etc. He did a great job on Parker.
Artest isn’t able to do that nor is Fish or Jordan. Perhaps Shannon Brown can but I didn’t see Phil use him in that way. (I do hope Shannon comes back.)
by lazNirv on Jul 4, 2009 11:19 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
u are right. all of those players present match up nightmares for the lakers. nobody on our team could guard them, not kobe, ariza or lamar. artest has a better chance, however.
by chaucer on Jul 3, 2009 11:47 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
stupid ass david lee
He f***ed it up by trying to get more money
by shaqfor3 on Jul 3, 2009 10:31 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
artests a great addition
i just hate to see ariza go….
by shaqfor3 on Jul 3, 2009 10:32 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Alright then, serious question :
It’s game 5 of the Finals. You’re on the road. The series is tied 2-2. It’s the middle of the third quarter with 7 minutes left. Kobe is already back on the floor with D Fish, Pau, Odom, and Kobe. You’re down. By 12. You have both Ariza and Artest on the bench. Who are you going to put in? Who do you really want…..
by _logan_ on Jul 3, 2009 11:44 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
the scenario doesn’t call for one or the other.
by chaucer on Jul 3, 2009 11:48 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
If you're down by 12 with 7 minutes to go in the Finals, you're gonna lose with either Artest or Ariza...
The real question is this: which one of those guys is more apt to GET you to the Finals?
I’d rather have Ariza, myself.
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
by timbo on Jul 4, 2009 10:30 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
ure down 12, probably artest since he is the better offensive player and also the better defender. in other words, u tend to go with the better players, unless they are struggling in that game.
by chaucer on Jul 3, 2009 11:49 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Artest
That is easy. If the Lakers or more dependent on defense they you put in Ariza. If the Lakers are more dependent on both defense and offense then you put in Artest….
by PURPLE AND GOLD FOR LIFE on Jul 3, 2009 11:49 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Who cares? The Lakers would have Kobe right?
But I’d probably have Ariza because he knows his role and wouldn’t try to go overboard. He’d just camp out or cut into the passing lane for the easy 3 or the easy lay-up or dunk.
by intuitive on Jul 4, 2009 12:08 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
i dont get it. it was on ariza’s twitter? but who wrote it?
by chaucer on Jul 4, 2009 12:09 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Nope not on Ariza’s twitter on some one elses.
by intuitive on Jul 4, 2009 12:09 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
no one knows what is going on with him...
by PURPLE AND GOLD FOR LIFE on Jul 3, 2009 11:51 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
i don’t know if you heard phil’s interview today on the radio, but he was saying that lamar’s still out looking for the biggest contract he can find. phil was saying something about how he on one hand wants lamar to do well and find a huge contract but then also wants him to not find something great and have to come back to the lakers as a bargain. he made it sound like there weren’t a whole lot of good offers…
by _logan_ on Jul 3, 2009 11:54 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
damn. that doesn’t sound good. lamar is just coming off a great contract. he made 14 or 17 million last year…i guess he doesn’t really want to win. it’s all about the money with these greedy bastards.
by chaucer on Jul 3, 2009 11:56 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
phil said it sounded like there wasn’t any way he was going to make the same amount he did last year.
by _logan_ on Jul 3, 2009 11:57 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
i agree. not with the lakers nor anyone else.
by chaucer on Jul 3, 2009 11:58 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
He made $11m, but it counted as $14m against the cap, because of the Shaq trade.
The best offer LO can get at this point is roughly $9m/year from Portland, but the question is this: does Portland want to spend its cap space on another PF, or on a quality starting PG? Blake is a great backup who can start, but he is not a true starting PG. Bayless hasn’t shown he can carry that load yet either, though he has the potential. The Blazers need to upgrade that spot if they want to contend, certainly more than they need a 30 year old backup PF. Of course, the allure of screwing the Lakers might be too much for the Blazers to resist.
by Darkemans on Jul 4, 2009 5:21 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Just to add, I think if the Blazers offer LO $9m/year, the Lakers will match it.
That’s roughly in line with what a good number of people thought he would get from the Lakers before the free agency period began.
by Darkemans on Jul 4, 2009 5:23 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Portland can get over the $9M mark if they really want to. Word from David Aldridge (who seems to have a good source) is that they offered Turk $57M/5 yrs.
But they are not shopping for a PF, at least not one like Lamar — they need a 10-15 minutes guy that can really ruck, a la Brandon Bass. If KP spends the really big bucks, it would be for David Lee, I think — but I doubt he does that deal either.
Signing LO to an offer sheet might make good strategic sense for the Blazers, just to make sure that the Lakers are tapped out, but I doubt they will seriously pursue. KP has (somewhat surprisingly) signaled his satisfaction with the current PG situation, and the team is set at SG and C. The quest is for a SF that can really score to take pressure off Roy…
Being under the salary cap (unlike almost anybody else) Blazers are in a position where they can trade for the guy they need, sending out (for example) the very desirable Travis Outlaw ($4M) and taking back a $14M contract in exchange. I’d look for that to happen rather than a FA signing.
No, Luke Walton is not that man, ha ha.
BTW: why the hell did Ariza agree to MLE money so quickly? Very strange decision there… Rumor has it that he was the #2 SF on KP’s shopping list…
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
by timbo on Jul 4, 2009 10:39 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
actually, here’s your lamar update :http://tiny.cc/MFgIN
by _logan_ on Jul 4, 2009 12:32 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Gotta love those white lapels Lamar is rockin’ That dude is a fashion risk taker!
by lazNirv on Jul 4, 2009 11:26 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
just noticed that it looks like Turkoglu is going to Toronto, so that takes them out of the Odom sweepstakes…
by _logan_ on Jul 4, 2009 12:16 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
But now Portland might be interesting in Lamar
by intuitive on Jul 4, 2009 12:17 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
If Lamar signs else where we’re pretty screwed. I think he’ll stay though, but then again I was saying that about Ariza just 2 weeks ago and look what happened since..
by intuitive on Jul 4, 2009 12:28 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
yeah and odom would be perfect in portland. david lee could replace odom perhaps…
by _logan_ on Jul 4, 2009 12:29 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
We can’t sign anymore guys unless its for the veterans minimum. The only guy we can throw a big contract at is Lamar. Besides that we’re done because we’re too much over the salary cap and we used our MLE on Artest
by intuitive on Jul 4, 2009 1:07 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
This is correct. Lakers can pay to the hilt for LO, but if they are lose him they are seriously screwed, having already used the MLE.
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
by timbo on Jul 4, 2009 10:44 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
so we can offer lamar a contract extension, well above the MLE without being penalized by the luxury tax? this isn’t clear to me…
by chaucer on Jul 4, 2009 6:15 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
No, we can offer him however much we want but it will still count towards the salary cap and we will still have to pay the luxury tax for it.
by intuitive on Jul 4, 2009 11:01 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
so we can offer lamar a contract extension, well above the MLE without being penalized by the luxury tax? this isn’t clear to me…
by chaucer on Jul 4, 2009 6:15 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
if there was no artest (aka plan B)
i’m pretty sure mitch would’ve matched for ariza and we would have gotten ariza back. since there isn’t a very good option B for Odom, they’ll probably do everything they can to keep him. At this point in his career, Odom probably doesn’t want to move for a small raise.
by Nostance on Jul 4, 2009 1:12 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Ugh, horrible move
They just gutted their whole roster for a guy who is going to decline horribly in about two years. Plus, their starting five is going to be an awful defensive lineup. Good for us though; takes another team out of the Odom hunt, although I’m not sure why Toronto would want him in the first place.
by Ben R on Jul 4, 2009 12:29 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
which also makes it sound like he’s coming back ;)
by _logan_ on Jul 3, 2009 11:57 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Artest or Ariza
Who would you rather have guard Paul Pierce or Lebron in the NBA finals?
I think that’s an easy answer.
The lakers finally have an enforcer on defense to protect its superstar.ala what Rodman did for MJ. Now, Kobe doesn’t have to expend his energy guarding the other team’s best player
by Dodger16 on Jul 4, 2009 12:04 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Ariza is a pretty good defender, just saying.
by intuitive on Jul 4, 2009 12:09 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Definitely
I’ve been calling for a stronger wing defender for a long time, and Artest fits the bill.
But by the same token – who would you rather have guard Tony Parker, Aaron Brooks? Ariza was the kind of fleet-footed wing you could put on speedy PGs and give them a lot of trouble. It took pressure away from our awful PG defense in Fisher.
So we’ve traded types of wing defenders. Now we get a bruiser to guard the bigger wings, but we lose that quick, lanky defender that we could put on small PGs. Ariza did a better job on those little guys than anyone else on the team. Now Fisher’s awful defense will be even more under the spotlight.
by Snoopy2006 on Jul 4, 2009 12:35 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yeap. Ariza did a great job on Parker, Artest can’t guard him. Parker is wayy too fast for him
by intuitive on Jul 4, 2009 1:06 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
i’m hardly threatened by the fact we lost a guy who can guard Parker. Artest isn’t supposed to be guarding the 1 anyway. That’s either the job of our 1 guard or Kobe.
by Dodger16 on Jul 4, 2009 8:12 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
But I’m saying we had the luxury to have Trevor be able to guard Parker and do a very good job on him. By the way our 1 guard would be Derek Fisher…. Fisher guarding Parker is a nightmare in the making
by intuitive on Jul 4, 2009 11:45 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
"That’s either the job of our 1 guard or Kobe."
You have watched Lakers games this past year, haven’t you? You’ve noticed that guy called Fish with cement in his shoes? Or the little dude with big ears who magically disappears every time a screen is set?
Let’s be realistic. The #1 weakness of this team, as stated all year long, was PG defense. Ariza was a big answer to that. And you really want to tell Kobe to guard Parker for 30+ minutes?
by Snoopy2006 on Jul 5, 2009 2:42 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re-reading my post
That came off incredibly wrong. Wasn’t meant to be personal at all. I just meant we have to acknowledge we’re switching types of defenders. Bringing in a guy who can guard big wings, but losing our best defender at the point. Because our current PGs are awful defensively, and Kobe can’t carry that burden for a long period of time.
by Snoopy2006 on Jul 5, 2009 3:03 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
That's why Farmar is so essential
Him using his decent playoff performance to rebound from last year is critical. The allure of a contract year may be something working in our favor, but he definitely has the skill to become the PG we all thought he would at the start of last year. Aside from this, bringing back Brown, especially for some of the bigger PGs we’ll see in the playoffs, is a good thing.
If this doesn’t pan out, we might see some Kobe-Artest-Odom-Gasol-Bynum lineups. Now, that would be really interesting.
by Ben R on Jul 4, 2009 1:27 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Btw, the Pacers have contacted Shannon.
Things are relatively quiet on the Pacers’ free agent front these days.
That usually happens when you don’t have much money to spend.
This time is being occupied by some of the marquee free agents — Ben Gordon, Ron Artest, Trevor Ariza and Hedo Turkoglu.
Add guards Luther Head (Miami) and Shannon Brown (Lakers) to the list of players the Pacers have contacted.
http://blogs.indystar.com/pacersinsider/archives/2009/07/pretty_quiet_ri.html
by intuitive on Jul 4, 2009 12:10 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Wouldn't worry too much about it
Teams throw feelers around to free agents all the time. I’m pretty confident he’s coming back to LA.
by Ben R on Jul 4, 2009 12:30 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
me neither I think Shannon will be back
There are basic Fundamentals that are needed to move forward in this game. Always keep your guard up at all times to avoid being caught in a trap. Overcome the fouls that will be commited against you REBOUND AND PRESS ON. ADJUST to the LimeLight: ALL-STAR PLAYERS ARE ALWAYS THE CENTER OF ATTENTION. Know what your role is and play your position. Find a game plan and execute it. REMEMBER YOU ONLY GET OUT OF THE GAME WHAT YOU PUT INTO IT.
by BrittneyM on Jul 4, 2009 1:08 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
and Ariza’s finally talking. Sad to see him go :(
But the Rockets could offer the one thing he needed most. They really, really needed him.
"I’m not a greedy person and the Lakers know I’m not a greedy person," Ariza, 24, said. "You can see it in the way I play. I just want to play for a team that wants me, the team that gives me the chance to improve my game.
"I’m excited about it because I’m getting an opportunity to play. They were the team that showed the most interest in me and that was all I wanted."
The Rockets could give him that. With Ariza’s decision to accept the five-year deal worth roughly $33 million, the Rockets and Lakers effectively swapped free agents, with Ron Artest going to Los Angeles and Ariza going from triumph with the Lakers to opportunity with the Rockets.
"I’m a champion," he said. "And I’m a Houston Rocket."
http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/sports/bk/bkn/6510699.html
"Yeah, I don’t know what’s going to happen with them," Ariza said of McGrady and Yao. "But that team played hard. They always compete and that’s the way I play no matter who is down.
"That team fought without T-Mac and without Yao and I’m a fighter too. I’ve always been a fighter and I’m going to roll with them, with the Rockets."
by intuitive on Jul 4, 2009 12:13 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
I feel sad but he should of jumped when the Lakers called instead he crawled, BAD IDEA
I will miss him but we have to start looking forward and I feel Artest will do just fine as a Laker. Now does anyone have reports on whats up with Lamar??
There are basic Fundamentals that are needed to move forward in this game. Always keep your guard up at all times to avoid being caught in a trap. Overcome the fouls that will be commited against you REBOUND AND PRESS ON. ADJUST to the LimeLight: ALL-STAR PLAYERS ARE ALWAYS THE CENTER OF ATTENTION. Know what your role is and play your position. Find a game plan and execute it. REMEMBER YOU ONLY GET OUT OF THE GAME WHAT YOU PUT INTO IT.
by BrittneyM on Jul 4, 2009 1:11 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Is anyone else scratching their head at what Toronto did?
$50-60 million (the exact number somewhere between there) for five years for a 30-year old defensive liability on a team full of them? Calderon-DeRozan-Turkoglu-Bosh-Bargnani is going to be an absolutely horrible defensive unit. That starting five has enough talent to sneak into the playoffs in the East, but that’s the most they’re going to do. They also nuked all of their depth — they had to renounce their rights to basically all of their free agents. I’m actually somewhat disappointed that he went to Toronto instead of nuking Portland’s cap space for a guy who is going to decline significantly in two years.
by Ben R on Jul 4, 2009 1:34 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
no idea
honestly, I have no clue what kind of team Toronto is trying to put together. The lightest pound per inch team in the league? Do they have anyone on that roster anymore that’s over 150 lbs?
j/k
They obviously like shooters, but who’s the post bulk? Who’s the slasher? The energy player? The perimeter threat? etc.
Now begins the Shawn Marion watch. I think this leaves us down to Marion, Rasheed Wallace, Lamar Odom, and Allen Iverson as the best remaining free agents. There’s also Anderson Varejao, and a couple of other role players.
"The problem actually is that PER is a extra-long, double high wagon load of horse crap." - timbo (7/3/09)
by tandur on Jul 4, 2009 2:00 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
The mood in Blazerland is certainly not heartbroken over losing Turkoglu...
I happen to think he was a great fit for Portland since he plays “Roy-speed,” but that’s not universal and who knows how bad a $12M deal (or whatever the end years of that contract work out to) looks 4 or 5 years hence…
Toronto is gonna lose Bosh and it’s gonna be very, very grim for them at that point. The signing makes little sense on the face of it.
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
by timbo on Jul 4, 2009 10:49 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
if we cannot land odom, i’d like us to go after marion, provided he doesn’t want a ton of money. i know he’s not the same player we saw on phoenix…
by chaucer on Jul 4, 2009 8:49 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
With what, the minimum?
We already used our full MLE to sign Artest. Marion isn’t signing anywhere for less than the full MLE.
by Ben R on Jul 4, 2009 10:03 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Marion will absolutely command full MLE from any of about 10 teams...
Lakers MUST retain Odom.
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
by timbo on Jul 4, 2009 10:50 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
10 teams? Bit of a hyperbole
A few contenders would like him, but past that, not a whole lot of teams are going to deal with his reputation for being difficult. His rather precipitous decline hasn’t helped any either. I’d wager Cleveland signs him at this juncture.
by Ben R on Jul 4, 2009 11:06 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
David Lee's Contact
http://www.eurobasket.com/agency.asp?AgentNm=Lee%20David&AgencyNm=David%20Lee%20services
don’t know how updated it is, but it’s trying to shoot an email over or knocking on his door if you’ve in the NY area
by Dodger16 on Jul 4, 2009 9:34 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Friedman on the Ariza/Artest debacale
http://20secondtimeout.blogspot.com/2009/07/artest-versus-ariza.html
by intuitive on Jul 4, 2009 11:57 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Artest is way better than Ariza
I loved what Trevor brought, but he didn’t bring a few (very) important things:
1) He is simply not that strong. Kobe should not be guarding Melo. Period. That is the job of the small forward. Wasting our most valuble player’s energy on a mistmatch forced by our too slight (former) small forward is unacceptable. Full stop.
2) Ariza just didn’t make the best basketball decisions. I watched him drive to the hoop and throw up wild shots far too many times this postseason. Many of them went in off lucky bank shots or divinely inspired rim rolls. I cringed every time he took the ball into a crowd. His passing skills definitely take a back seat to RonRon.
3) The triangle offense, aka triple post offense, shines when all five players on the floor can post up. It adds versatility to the team and allows the ball better movement. Trevor doesn’t have a post game.
4) Durability. Take a quick look at how many games Ariza has played in the last six years. Out of a possible 492 regular season games, he has played in 231. That frightens me when talking about a player with a five year contract.
Ron’s defense and offense are better than Ariza. People talk about basketball players being in their prime in their late twenties; a player’s game has developed enough to more than compensate for their declining athleticism (Kobe turned 30 this year and has definitely lost some athletic ability). Ariza will be like Stoudamire, peaking when he is 26 because his game is predicated on his quickness and explosiveness.
by busterjonez on Jul 4, 2009 1:13 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
i’m sad to see ariza go. i really like him. however, i like this move simply because we needed a guy with artest’s physicality and toughness. we needed to make some change rather than stand put while everyone arms themselves with better weapons. this should work…no guarantee, but i’m hopeful.
by chaucer on Jul 4, 2009 6:06 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
so it has been said that kobe, phil and lamar sent several text messages to ron artest, swaying him to come to LA. if lamar really did help try to recruit him, then what the hell is taking so long for him to sign with the lakers?
by chaucer on Jul 4, 2009 6:14 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Kobe and Lamar didn’t, Phil did talk to Artest though. Artest hung out at Lamar’s house but he didn’t say anything about coming over to the Lakers. I don’t think he did at least.
by intuitive on Jul 4, 2009 11:02 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Also...
Another reason Lamar hasn’t signed yet (assuming he will), is because the Lakers have to sign other teams free agents first. You can’t go over the cap to sign another team’s free agents, but you can go over the cap to resign yours. This way the Lakers can now proceed to offer the rest of the money that they are willing to give up for him.
by Jeremiah S on Jul 5, 2009 3:09 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
This is incorrect.
A team that is over the cap can sign another team’s free agents if it uses the mid-level exception (MLE), biannual exception (aka low-level exception) or veteran’s minimum. The Lakers were already over both the cap and the tax line when the free agent period began. They used the MLE on Artest. They could have signed Odom first and it would have made no difference—except that Artest might not have been available by then.
by Darkemans on Jul 5, 2009 7:54 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
The biannual exception is something like $2.3 Million, is it not?
Did the Lakers use that last year?
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
by timbo on Jul 5, 2009 10:01 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Larry Coon knows better than me, so:
BI-ANNUAL EXCEPTION — This exception was previously named the “$1 Million exception” (perhaps “misnamed” is more appropriate, since it was only valued at $1 million in 1998-99). It may be used to sign any free agent to a contract starting at the following amounts:
2005-06 $1.67 million
2006-07 $1.75 million
2007-08 $1.83 million
2008-09 $1.91 million
2009-10 $1.99 million
2010-11 $2.08 million
2011-12 $2.18 million
This exception may not be used two years in a row (and if the $1 Million exception was used in 2004-05, the Bi-Annual exception may not be used in 2005-06). It may be split and given to more than one player, and can be used to sign players for up to two years, with raises limited to 8%. Also see question number 20 for more information on the availability and use of this exception.
by Darkemans on Jul 6, 2009 7:42 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Digging the #3...
Tracy McGrady, Carl Landry, Aaron Brooks, and Ariza leading the fast break sometime next season…
Well, that is going to have to happen within the first 20 games, before McGrady shuts it down with a (Insert Back or Knee Injury Here).
Then when you come to the realization that the Rockets lineup is going to be:
PG: Aaron Brooks
SG: Shane Battier(This is post McGrady injury)
SF: Trevor Ariza
PF: Carl Landry
C: Luis Scola
You realize that this team really isn’t all that ferocious… Can’t make your living feeding Yao the ball, when he’s on the sidelines. I doubt Ariza can be a go to guy. Luis Scola will get overmatched playing against bigs. Carl Landry probably hasn’t had plays run for him since college. Shane Battier is a situation scorer. So. Aaron Brooks is the going to have to carry the team. Can you say: Opening in the Western Conference Playoff Race?
Pheonix Suns make the playoffs, unless they trade away Amare. Then…hell…I give the Clippers the edge. Why? I dunno. I just think it’d be funny.
by Jeremiah S on Jul 5, 2009 3:07 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Rockets are doomed with that lineup...
Battier as SG? Good luck, he’s a Bruce Bowen/sit in the corner 3 ball shooter. Brooks is streaky and too small to get to the rack, Trevor is a 10 ppg guy, give or take, Landry is undersized and no big scorer, and Scola is a “Center” only in quotes if you are talking about some sort of rec league team.
Bring them on!!!!!!1
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
by timbo on Jul 5, 2009 10:03 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Suns will be even worse.
"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal
by timbo on Jul 5, 2009 10:05 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
As long as Nash and Stoudemire are there
Then no. Simply too much scoring to have a floor like Houston. Granted, if either leave…
To secure ourselves against defeat lies in our own hands, but the opportunity of defeating the enemy is provided by the enemy himself.
by Ben R on Jul 6, 2009 2:51 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs


























