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Ron Artest in Purple and Gold

Going into the free agency period, it seemed that Mitch Kupchack and the Lakers had one goal in mind, to keep the status quo.  Consensus was to bring back the guys who won it last year, and the Lakers would be in the best position possible to win the championship again.  The Lakers were surely not the team that would be making a huge splash through acquisition of big name players.  Right?

Status quo, meet Ron Artest.  Consensus, let me introduce you to the Tru Warier. 

Even though we’d heard a ton of rumors and (supposedly fake) Twitters that Artest was heading to the Los Angeles Lakers, the actual event certainly qualifies as a stunning development.  That it happened long before anything with Trevor Ariza or Lamar Odom was resolved made it all the more unexpected.  Add in the fact that this move can fall anywhere on the scale from pure genius to pure idiocy, and you’ve got yourself a pretty ridiculous situation.  So let’s get down to the implications of this move.  I’ll be looking at it from all possible angles, because somewhere in between "The 2009-2010 Lakers will not lose a game" and "We just killed a dynasty before it even happened" lies the truth.

After the jump, what does it all mean?

Star-divide

Trevor Ariza is done with the Lakers

At least for the foreseeable future.  Signing Artest for the exact same money that the Lakers offered Ariza is more than writing on the wall for TA, it’s an actual pink slip.  Apparently, he and Artest are simply going to switch spots, with Ariza accepting from Houston the same offer he apparently turned down from LA … what the hell?!?  Has there ever been a straight up "trade" of two guys, playing the same position, who decide to sign with each other’s teams for the same amount of money, completely independently?  Anyways, let’s all take a second to remember the awesomeness Ariza brought to the table, and recognize the fact that L.A. likely does not win a championship without his play last season. 

 

Now that we’ve enjoyed that little moment of silence, here’s why signing Ron Artest was an incredible move that surely is a sign of great success for the Lakers next year.

The Lakers just signed a former All-Star and Defensive Player of the Year, still pretty much in his prime at age 30, to the Mid Level Exception, and for the relatively modest term of three years.

That, ladies and gentlemen, does not happen every day.  The Lakers certainly can not be accused of over-paying to get Ron Artest.  Baggage aside, this guy is a defensive monster, and has above average skill offensively too.  And we’re paying him the league average.  Just based on his skill set, this signing is a coup.  Make no mistake about it, Ron Artest is a better player than Trevor Ariza.  Ariza is a very good defender, but Artest is one of the best defenders in the league.  Ron-Ron’s strength is second to one at his position (a guy who goes by the name of Bron-Bron).  Ariza developed a wonderful niche as an improved three point shooter, and decent finisher on the fast break.  Artest is coming off one of his best seasons shooting the 3 (5% better than Ariza) and has never had a season where he averaged less points than Ariza had last year (in Ariza’s breakout season).  On defense, it’s really no contest that Artest is better.  On offense, player for player, it’s really no contest that Artest is better.  Ariza has great potential, and came a long way to realizing that potential last year.  But I’m not even sure Ariza’s potential matches Artest’s actual ability right now.

The Lakers have more than enough personality to manage Crazy Pills.

Yes, Ron Artest is a little bit crazy.  I won’t get into the Malice at the Palace, the Sacramento years, the technical fouls, the bum rush charge against one Kobe Bryant in this year’s playoffs, or any of the many incidents the man has had.  We all know he is  … er, temperamental.  However, he was on good behavior last year.  Further, he’s got two guys in the Lakers locker room he likes and respects (Kobe and Lamar, and yes, I’m assuming LO re-signs with LA at this point).  He’s also got a coach in Phil Jackson (another assumption, just deal with it) who managed to get Dennis Rodman to play some of the best, most focused, years of his career.  Dennis Rodman makes Ron Artest look like Derek Fisher.  Also, Kobe dominates the locker room no matter who’s in it, and Artest knows it.  There is no team better equipped to get the most out of a player like Ron Artest.

Ron-Ron is in it to win it.

Artest said during his brief time as a free agent that he wanted to go to a team with a legitimate chance to win a ring.  He said after agreeing to sign with LA, "I’ve made money over my time in the NBA.  … I’m not playing for the money anymore."  Do these sound like the quotes of a guy who’s likely to be a problem to team chemistry?  Does it sound like he thinks he needs to come to LA and be "the man"?  From the sound bytes, it certainly seems like Artest has the overly mature goal of contributing to a championship team.  He has already agreed to less money than he is probably worth (albeit in a market where he wasn’t likely to get offered much more.)

Defensively, Artest takes the Lakers to a whole new level.

The Lakers perimeter defense now has two first team All-NBA defenders on it.  I’m not taking the time to research it, but I’m guessing that hasn’t happened since Pippen-Jordan.  Even with Derek Fisher’s corpse, or Jordan Farmer’s inexperience, LA’s back court should be as strong defensively as anyone’s.  And, if the 2009 playoffs is any indication, their front line isn’t terrible defensively either.  God help the NBA if L.A. re-signs Shannon Brown.

Have I got you excited?  Now that I’ve built the wall up, I’m going to tear it right back down.  Here’s why this move was horrible, and dooms the Lakers next year and in years to come.

We just broke up a championship team, built on great chemistry, to bring in one of the worst "character" guys in the NBA

You know the old saying, right?  The one that goes "If it ain’t broke, don’t trade for a guy who got suspended for a year because he attacked a fan in the stands."  The Lakers just did exactly the opposite.  Considering Ariza just signed a contract for a similar amount of money, couldn’t the Lakers have just re-signed Ariza and had the same team that just won a championship?  A team should be allowed to defend it’s championship, Ariza played an important role on that team, and he was a chemistry guy.  Artest is a ball hog who ruins offenses, gets lots of technicals, and is on a shorter leash with the refs than Rasheed Wallace.

The Lakers run an offense dependent on ball movement … and they just signed the basketball equivalent of a Black Hole.

Remember the playoffs?  Houston vs. LA?  Games 3-7?  Where Artest almost single-handedly murdered the Rockets chances with possession after possession of dribble-dribble-dribble-dribble-dribble, fall away 20 foot jump shot?  Do you want to see that for your home team Los Angeles Lakers?  No?  Too bad.  Ron Artest is where offensive possessions go to die. 

The Lakers did NOT need another player who needs the ball in his hands.  They didn’t need another All-Star.  They needed a role player who does his job well and doesn’t need/expect anything else.

Outside of the defense, Artest is the anti-Ariza.  He takes a lot of shots, many of them are ill-advised, he likes/needs to have the ball in his hands, and he is probably no better than 5th on the Lakers in terms of offensive efficiency.  He will certainly not be 5th in shots.  Where Ariza fit perfectly into what the Lakers wanted out of their wing, Artest is square peg in a round hole.  Artest has either been "the man" or has thought he was "the man" on every team he’s ever been with, and he won’t be able to just throw that away and defer to Kobe, Gasol, Odom and Bynum on the offensive end.

Are the Lakers crazy?  Don’t they know he’s Ron Artest?

We’ve glossed over it a couple times, but it must be mentioned.  Artest did attack a fan at a basketball game.  He was suspended for an entire year.  Yes, it was a long time ago.  But it’s also not an isolated incident, just (by far) the worst.  He had problems with flagrant fouls and suspensions in his early days in Chicago.  He inexplicably ran across the court to confront our own Kobe Bryant in the playoffs … after he had complained to the refs about a foul call.  And he’s always, always, been good for a few comments a year that shouldn’t be said.  The refs target him with cheap techinicals and ejections because of his history.  He’s a distraction to the nth degree.  And we just brought him onto what was a championship squad that was delightfully free of locker room drama.

Where do I actually stand on all this?  As is my duty as a Lakers fan, moreso on the positive side than the negative side, until proven otherwise.  While I will miss Ariza, there's little doubt in my mind that Artest brings more to the table than Trevor will ever be able to bring.  I do think the combination of Kobe and Phil can keep Ron under control, and the Bronx connection with LO will keep Ron happy.  And when I say "Keep him under control", I don't mean they'll be able to keep him from flipping out, because I don't really think that's a neccesary concern.  I mean they'll be able to keep him focused on the team, and make him be able to realize that he needs to change the way he plays, especially on offense, in order to provide the team what it needs.  There's no doubt that this move is a risk, but I think it also carries high reward.  This signing should clear the way for LA to re-sign Odom, and that leaves L.A. with a roster better on paper than the one that won them a championship. 

What do you think?  There's certainly a wide array of options to choose from.

Poll
Was signing Ron Artest the right move for the Lakers?
Yes, Artest was the best wing available and the Lakers got him cheap
3801 votes
Yes, paying Artest the same money Ariza would have gotten is a wise investment
2027 votes
No, Ariza fit better into what the Lakers needed from the wing
645 votes
No, Artest will ruin the team chemistry
281 votes

6754 votes | Poll has closed

1 recs  |  Comment 112 comments |

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Remember how people used to say free agents wouldn't come to LA because of Kobe?

It only takes one counter-example to prove that theory wrong.

"This is not a game for boys. This is a game for men." - Phil Jackson

by Gils_Keloids on Jul 2, 2009 11:39 PM PDT reply actions  

But we liked it

And then we put a ring on it.

by _logan_ on Jul 2, 2009 11:51 PM PDT up reply actions   2 recs

Nice one

To Ron: Welcome to Hollywood.

"This is not a game for boys. This is a game for men." - Phil Jackson

by Gils_Keloids on Jul 2, 2009 11:53 PM PDT up reply actions  

except...

kobe, odom, and gasol are pretty much irreplaceable. you’re never gonna find guys with those unique abilities.

gasol passing and scoring, odoms size AND speed, and kobe’s flat out ballerness

by robi s on Jul 3, 2009 1:17 AM PDT up reply actions  

I’m going to miss Trevor. He knew his role on the team and did exactly what was asked of him.

by intuitive on Jul 2, 2009 11:49 PM PDT reply actions  

I was starting to think that he was the future Magic Johnson character-wise… That the city would come to embrace him in a way they never could Kobe. He has a child-like optimism that both Magic and Shaq shared that lent themselves to the public’s embrace… Anyways, whatever. He was my fave Laker and I’m super bummed. Although I did like Artest’s “five dollar footlong” hilarity and look forward to more of that. Come on Artest, what do you think of the “mini sirloin burger” song?

by _logan_ on Jul 2, 2009 11:58 PM PDT up reply actions  

it’s his fault man. he screwed up. the lakers offered him the same money he took in houston. he didn’t want that. what does that tell you?

by chaucer on Jul 3, 2009 12:37 PM PDT up reply actions  

No kidding

The money wasn’t better, and God knows the situation isn’t even close. He could have taken the same money and been on a much better team, with odds to repeat, in a much better city, with fans that were much more fond of him than Houston fans will be.

His bad.

Strength & Honor
16...15...14...13...12...11...10...9...8...7...6...5...4...3...2...1...CHAMPIONSHIP!!!

by Josh Tucker on Jul 3, 2009 12:38 PM PDT up reply actions  

Yeah, this is head-scratcher for sure.

GO BRONCOS IN 2009 AND BEYOND!!

2009 NBA Champions L.A Lakers
2009 NBA Finals MVP Kobe Bryant

by weazel on Jul 3, 2009 6:59 PM PDT up reply actions  

Here’s a report on how it happened from Hoopsworld. Halfway down the page.

It says the Lakers offered more than he signed for with Houston but his agent took it as an insult. So the Lakers who were worried he’d end up with a rival went after Artest.

Too bad because I liked the guy a lot. Don’t care for Artest personally but I recognize he has skills and I guess I have to give him a chance. Plus he might play better on Melo, Pierce & LeBron than Trevor.

by lazNirv on Jul 3, 2009 11:50 PM PDT up reply actions  

Sorry, I see it was already posted down below.

by lazNirv on Jul 4, 2009 12:02 AM PDT up reply actions  

Wasnt the smartest trade but it was smart.

Artest is a amazing player I must admit. But Ariza, to me, was one of the best defensive players I’ve seen since scottie pippen. Maybe it will work out if Artest play well with Kobe and the rest of the Lakers. We will have to see what happens.

by Phillyy on Jul 2, 2009 11:55 PM PDT reply actions  

"This is not a game for boys. This is a game for men." - Phil Jackson

by Gils_Keloids on Jul 2, 2009 11:57 PM PDT reply actions  

I think Ariza might have just killed his career

He fit in perfectly with the Lakers, where he was 4th or 5th fiddle and could just do his thing. There was no pressure, so he was able to play relaxed and focus defensively. He is by no means a star and cannot really create his own shot. He is the ultimate teammate, and I think that in Houston he will be asked to do too much.

by Sideout11 on Jul 3, 2009 12:53 AM PDT up reply actions  

god i hope not. that sounds awful. he doesn't deserve that.

The greatest trick the devil ever pulled was convincing the world he didn't exist.

by Justin N. on Jul 3, 2009 12:53 AM PDT up reply actions  

Well you can thank his agent Mr. Lee for all of this.

Don’t get me wrong I have always said Artest was our answer at PF, but I loved TA and his do all attitude. Sometimes you need to tell your agent where he stands, this guy pulled a power play with Bynum and now this. Basically we over paid for AB and Lee was behind all of that, so if lee thought he could get more for TA he shouldn’t have robbed us for AB.

Paul D. Kelley

by so.cal.native1952 on Jul 3, 2009 10:51 AM PDT up reply actions  

Bit of an overstatement

He still has room to develop his game; he’ll be tutored by arguably the league’s best on-the-ball defender in Battier and has commented that he’ll develop a midrange game over the summer. Now, Houston is going to suck horribly next year, but if they let Yao and McGrady go, they’ll have tons of cap space in 2010 to throw around, and as previously noted, Houston is a summer destination for a surprising number of NBA players. I’d trust Morey with the rebuilding process, and as such, Ariza’s career.

by Ben R on Jul 3, 2009 12:56 AM PDT up reply actions  

houston is gonna have some great rugged young players that can play mean D, however they are still going to lottery town because they have 0 scorers.

by robi s on Jul 3, 2009 1:19 AM PDT up reply actions  

Agreed

Brooks-Battier-Ariza-Scola-Hayes is an extremely low-scoring unit. Houston is heading to lottery land unless McGrady and Yao return and make a miraculous comeback. Be interesting to see who sneaks into the playoff picture. Does Phoenix have enough steam left for a run? Does Golden State care about winning? Can OKC take the next step?

by Ben R on Jul 3, 2009 2:30 AM PDT up reply actions  

Or how about this one:

“Hey Kobe, you know I am going to be your teammate soon, so now you’ll hear this in practice.”

GO BRONCOS IN 2009 AND BEYOND!!

2009 NBA Champions L.A Lakers
2009 NBA Finals MVP Kobe Bryant

by weazel on Jul 3, 2009 7:01 PM PDT up reply actions  

Best move available given the circumstances

I think this has been discussed ad nauseum on the other thread though.

by Ben R on Jul 3, 2009 12:25 AM PDT reply actions  

What the heck?

You miss a day and you miss a year I guess. So many questions are running through my head right now that there will probably be a fanpost coming this weekend, but I’ll just trow this one out there right now:

Does Ron Artest deserve to win a championship?

Also, a hearty farewell to Ariza. Without you we could not have won number 15, and it’s a real shame that you could not remain a Laker. You will be missed, and best of luck in Houston.

by Sideout11 on Jul 3, 2009 12:50 AM PDT reply actions  

Not in particularly more than most 30 year olds in the league

The team that wins in the end and the players that won deserve(d) it.

The greatest trick the devil ever pulled was convincing the world he didn't exist.

by Justin N. on Jul 3, 2009 12:54 AM PDT up reply actions   1 recs

Maybe I should rephrase

Putting aside the fact the he is now a Laker, do you want to see Artest win a championship as a player considering his body of work to date?

For me the answer is no, but don’t worry, I will get over it quickly

by Sideout11 on Jul 3, 2009 12:57 AM PDT up reply actions  

if he is a lakers

he deserves a championship. period

by Adamas on Jul 3, 2009 12:58 AM PDT up reply actions  

is it because of his off/on court antics?

or really what he’s accomplished as a player…DPOY…league leader in scoring…competitor…plays defense hard…has helped his teams exceed expectations (as recently as last year). I’d say like other veterans he deserves it. If we’re playing this game: who deserves one more – Ron Artest or Amare? Ron Artest or Deron Williams?

The greatest trick the devil ever pulled was convincing the world he didn't exist.

by Justin N. on Jul 3, 2009 1:14 AM PDT up reply actions  

Ugh, if we're playing this game, then Amar'e definitely doesn't deserve one

No work ethic, horrible defender, whiner, whole list of negatives.

by Ben R on Jul 3, 2009 1:18 AM PDT up reply actions  

Well normally I try to disregard a player's troubles

and just evaluate him based on his play, but Artest is unique in my mind because almost all of his problems have been on-court issues that at times really cost his team. While i do not think that this will be a problem on the Lakers, I feel like for most of his career he did not play the game the “right way” (if there is such a thing; again, this is just my mind) and at times disrespected it.

If Artest were not on the Lakers and were playing in the Finals, I would be very apt to root against his team for those reasons. However, now that he will be donning the purple and gold, it’s not really an issue I guess. I just wanted to see people’s impressions on him because he is such a polarizing player.

(For reference, I will never want a championship for Artest the way I did for Pau, of Fish, or even Luke. If we win next year, I will look at Artest’s ring as the Lakers’ championship, not his)

by Sideout11 on Jul 3, 2009 1:31 AM PDT up reply actions  

Ask Houston

He’s been a great teammate and a good citizen for the Rockets.

"This is not a game for boys. This is a game for men." - Phil Jackson

by Gils_Keloids on Jul 3, 2009 10:19 AM PDT up reply actions  

r u kidding me he’s rodman with a J….enough said !!!!!

by bigdippa on Jul 3, 2009 1:51 PM PDT up reply actions  

Kind of an irrelevant question

Does Sun Yue deserve to win a championship before Yao? Luck and coincidence play a role sometimes. As far as Artest goes, I honestly don’t care if he deserves it or not; we want it as a team.

by Ben R on Jul 3, 2009 12:57 AM PDT up reply actions  

You said it.

If you don’t want Artest to win a championship, then you don’t want the Lakers to repeat.

GO BRONCOS IN 2009 AND BEYOND!!

2009 NBA Champions L.A Lakers
2009 NBA Finals MVP Kobe Bryant

by weazel on Jul 3, 2009 7:03 PM PDT up reply actions  

...when did I say that?

You’re not getting the point of my post.

by Ben R on Jul 3, 2009 7:26 PM PDT up reply actions  

Argh

My bad. I misconstrued it completely. My apologies to weazel.

by Ben R on Jul 3, 2009 8:46 PM PDT up reply actions  

No worries dude.

GO BRONCOS IN 2009 AND BEYOND!!

2009 NBA Champions L.A Lakers
2009 NBA Finals MVP Kobe Bryant

by weazel on Jul 3, 2009 11:49 PM PDT up reply actions  

does anybody know

how many more years we have gasol? i’m trying to figure out how long this core of kobe, odom (potentially), pau, artest, bynum will be together.

Chili Davis - the closest thing the MLB got to a real life Pedro Cerrano.

by NW angels Fan on Jul 3, 2009 12:57 AM PDT reply actions  

thanks

Chili Davis - the closest thing the MLB got to a real life Pedro Cerrano.

by NW angels Fan on Jul 3, 2009 12:58 AM PDT up reply actions  

Pau’s contract expires in the summer of 2011.

by intuitive on Jul 3, 2009 1:45 AM PDT up reply actions  

I'm not worried about us retaining Pau Gasol

Unless something drastic happens over the next 2 years, I expect re-signing Pau to be a much bigger priority for the Lakers than re-signing Ariza was, or even than Odom is right now.

Strength & Honor
16...15...14...13...12...11...10...9...8...7...6...5...4...3...2...1...CHAMPIONSHIP!!!

by Josh Tucker on Jul 3, 2009 12:32 PM PDT up reply actions  

hey, he’s back lol

by chaucer on Jul 3, 2009 12:38 PM PDT up reply actions  

Haha... sorry.

Work has been crazy for me lately. I’m trying to get back in gear here.

Strength & Honor
16...15...14...13...12...11...10...9...8...7...6...5...4...3...2...1...CHAMPIONSHIP!!!

by Josh Tucker on Jul 3, 2009 12:39 PM PDT up reply actions  

it does’nt matter im sure he’s lovin LA … not mention he just left a long miserable stint in memphis r u kidding me I think he’s here to stay !!!

by bigdippa on Jul 3, 2009 1:58 PM PDT up reply actions  

what is ariza going to do

now that there is nobody (read: kobe) to give him wide open shots in houston?

by Adamas on Jul 3, 2009 12:57 AM PDT reply actions  

What is kobe going to do

now that there is a guy (read: artest) taking contested fadeaways in LA?

by seanbergmanrules on Jul 3, 2009 1:08 AM PDT up reply actions  

Kobe has more authority than T-Mac, and is more assertive than Yao Ming

It won’t be a problem.

Strength & Honor
16...15...14...13...12...11...10...9...8...7...6...5...4...3...2...1...CHAMPIONSHIP!!!

by Josh Tucker on Jul 3, 2009 12:34 PM PDT up reply actions  

he might just continue to get them in houston but he will be going fishing every summer for the next five years !!!!!

by bigdippa on Jul 3, 2009 2:01 PM PDT up reply actions  

this was awesome

this makes me feel so much better about the chemistry between these two guys.

Chili Davis - the closest thing the MLB got to a real life Pedro Cerrano.

by NW angels Fan on Jul 3, 2009 1:17 AM PDT up reply actions  

Cool interview. Thanks dach.

GO BRONCOS IN 2009 AND BEYOND!!

2009 NBA Champions L.A Lakers
2009 NBA Finals MVP Kobe Bryant

by weazel on Jul 3, 2009 7:11 PM PDT up reply actions  

Good article from Woj:

http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news;_ylt=AlNvIkiRL1RFibrUusX5hhm8vLYF?slug=aw-artestkobe070309&prov=yhoo&type=lgns

The money quote:

"I told Mitch that it was never about the money; it was about respect," Lee told NBA.com.

Well, take your respect and pack your client’s bags for post-Yao lottery land in Houston. Respect? Yes, there are American soldiers and missionaries in faraway lands cheering for David Lee and this noble stand for the neglected and disenfranchised everywhere. It is about respect, and God knows a $33 million offer for Ariza’s eight points and four rebounds a game rates a disgraceful act.

No, this wasn’t about the money, nor his client’s needs. This was a failed power play, an embarrassment of the highest order. Looking back, Ariza will rue the day. He’s a good player, but he’ll never be a star elsewhere. He’ll just be another player on another team.

by Ben R on Jul 3, 2009 1:10 AM PDT reply actions   2 recs

Trevor and his agent have "respect" issues.

I love TA, but I get the feeling from his actions and his interviews that he’s a type of guy that needs a lot of validation. He likes proving others wrong. He’s always either not getting enough appreciation from a team or he’s not getting the respect he thinks he deserves.

Like when he left UCLA, he believed in himself so strongly (which is always great to have self confidence), but everyone told him he left the NBA too early. So he was drafted late to the Knicks. Larry Brown told him he was "delusional". Trevor then gets traded to Orlando where he gets benched because he was told his 3-point shooting (or lack of) was not useful to the team and so he finally gets traded to the Lakers, proves everyone wrong, gets a championship, shows his abilities and he personally said he enjoyed beating the Magic because it was the team that traded him. And his agent thinks he deserves “respect” to the tune of $9 million a year – which he’s still not getting with the Rockets.

Of course, this is probably not a reflection of his character on how the re-signing talks have ended up, but all this David Lee "not feeling the love" talk is making me think of TA’s entire career and how he’s never been able to stay in one organization for longer than two years.

But damn it, I’m going to miss Trevor and all his hustle plays. He was really fun to watch. I’m going into some heavy TA withdrawal right now.

Control yourself
Take only what you need from it

by PeanutButterSpread on Jul 3, 2009 3:19 AM PDT up reply actions  

He’s a good player, but he’ll never be a star elsewhere. He’ll just be another player on another team.

I read this quote and one other player immediately comes to mind: Devon George.

2009 LA Kings Hockey: thanks to Joe Sakic's snowblower, WE'RE BETTER THAN THE AV'S!!!!

by DodgerBlueBalls on Jul 3, 2009 9:04 AM PDT up reply actions  

if im ariza im firing my agent immediately and begging the lakers to take me back for a year contract for 250k, and then taking adam morrisons 5.6 mill.

Who honestly goes from a dynasty in the making to a lottery team with NO DIFFERENCE in MONEY

next thing you know we’re gonna see tom brady leave the pats for the lions.

by robi s on Jul 3, 2009 1:24 AM PDT reply actions  

I don’t know about begging to come back to the Lakers, but I would fire my agent.

by intuitive on Jul 3, 2009 1:46 AM PDT up reply actions  

I guess David Lee doesn’t know who Vladimir Radmanovic “was”.

by _logan_ on Jul 3, 2009 4:34 AM PDT up reply actions  

I AM FUCKING PISSED

How the hell could we lose Ariza??? I woke up feeling sooo peaceful only to hear of this unrivaled TRAGEDY!! Ariza fits perfectly well into the triangle offense. What the hell is going on in this freaking world? Is it being run by freaking Celtics? That has to be it.

This is going to take some time for me to get over.

I think I’m going to avoid all things basketball related for the next few days.

I suddenly feel the urge for alcohol……LOTS OF IT.

by wayde_316 on Jul 3, 2009 4:32 AM PDT reply actions  

Artest fits better

Better rebounder, much better passer, and he will hit the open 3s at a higher rate. He will also extend the life of 24 as Kobe will not have to guard the Paul Pierce’s, Melo’s, LeBrons, and other top tier wings in the NBA.

by 81 Witness on Jul 3, 2009 3:19 PM PDT up reply actions  

At least I was right in that you guys weren’t going to be able to keep Ariza. Too bad you signed someone better. Argh.

Straight from the No-Stat Zone to your computer!
Dunkin' Cheerleaders

by LatinD on Jul 3, 2009 8:38 AM PDT reply actions  

Artest For Ariza

This trade is the best thing for Kobe, Phil et al, bet Phil’s health is better now. If L.O. signs, Phil should be more inclined to return in ’10. Wow what a team! To rip a Gibson quote from his Doger locker room talks

by Stocker on Jul 3, 2009 9:04 AM PDT reply actions  

This "Trade" is about Three Things: Toughness, Rasheed Wallace, and the Boston Celtics

As psyched as I am about the championship, I have to admit one, tiny nagging seed of doubt in the depths of my soul about the 2009 Playoffs – we did not beat the Boston Celtics. That’s not to take anything away from the great run the Magic had, or the great season the Cavs had, but with a healthy Kevin Garnett, the Boston Celtics would have faced us in the Finals again. Absolutely no question about it.

And let me say what Mitch Kupchak knows about 2010. If the Celtics sign Rasheed Wallace and the other three stay healthy, the Boston Celtics will be back in the Finals next year, with another year of experience for Rajon Rondo and another of being big for Kendrick Perkins. Let us please not under-estimate the Boston Celtics in 2010. Kupchak sure isn’t. They are going to be physically intimidating, extremely long, and very, very tough if they add Wallace to their lineup.

We all know Artest is one of the top defenders of the league; but there’s no doubt that he is the TOUGHEST defender in the league. Physically, he can match up with anyone from a 2-guard to a 4. In other words, Artest could match up with Ray Allen, Paul Pierce, Rasheed Wallace, or Kevin Garnett (depending on who else is on the floor for the Lakers). Ariza could definitely give Allen and Pierce a hard time (though Pierce is much stronger physically), but Ariza could not come close to matching up with Wallace or Garnett.

With this one, brilliant move, Kupchak kept us one step ahead of the Celtics. Sure the Celts are getting older, but who doesn’t think that Allen, Garnett, Pierce, and Wallace have one or two more chances ahead? I love this “Trade.” We’ve gone from being the longest and most skilled offensive team in the league to the longest and toughest defensive team in the league as well.

Go Lakers, and can’t wait to see you, Celtics.

Nick “olhickory” Chavez (on SB’s “Blogging the Boys” too)

by olhickory on Jul 3, 2009 9:32 AM PDT reply actions  

People lets not forget this is Ron FREAKING ARTEST

The guy who is a CANCER in locker rooms.

We had a guy who was willing to come off the bench and make big plays after big plays.

Please will some tell me how the hell did we manage to lose this guy? Or better yet someone capture his agent and bring him to me I want to find out what the fu@k was going through his mind.

Couldn’t he just see a good thing and leave it alone.

by wayde_316 on Jul 3, 2009 10:33 AM PDT reply actions  

I’m not happy about losing Ariza either :( But I don’t believe the Artest is a “cancer” thing. That’s the least of our worries. It’s all about whether or not Artest and players on the court will work out

by intuitive on Jul 3, 2009 11:07 AM PDT up reply actions  

Yep, it's about execution

As Kobe would say

"This is not a game for boys. This is a game for men." - Phil Jackson

by Gils_Keloids on Jul 3, 2009 2:02 PM PDT up reply actions  

Couple of corrections to this post:

“He had problems with flagrant fouls and suspensions in his early days in Chicago.” You mean Indiana.

“the Bronx connection with LO will keep Ron happy.” You mean Queens.

Other than that, well done.

by Darkemans on Jul 3, 2009 10:54 AM PDT reply actions  

Ron was drafted by Chicago

That said, I don’t really recall the details of his stint there.

Strength & Honor
16...15...14...13...12...11...10...9...8...7...6...5...4...3...2...1...CHAMPIONSHIP!!!

by Josh Tucker on Jul 3, 2009 2:17 PM PDT up reply actions  

That was after Phil left (I think) and they played a very loose form of the triangle.

by intuitive on Jul 3, 2009 2:22 PM PDT up reply actions  

You're right.

My bad. I don’t recall any details of his stint there either. He didn’t hit my radar until the flagrant foul problems started in Indiana. I should have checked before posting.

by Darkemans on Jul 3, 2009 5:27 PM PDT up reply actions  

My view is that this is a terrible move for the Lakers...

Ariza was a role-player who knew his place and was a BETTER perimeter defender than Ron.

Ron is a chuck-chuck-chucker and it’s gonna make for an interesting night when Ron puts up 20 shots and Kobe puts up 25…

Or a boring night if you are one of the front-line players.

The Lakers’ glaring weakness was at the PG position and this does NOTHING to correct that.

"A bizarre and extremely rare hybrid Blazer/Laker fan, Timbo has always struggled to contain the Beast Within, like Dr. Jekyll, Bruce Banner, or Ted Kennedy." — Miled Animal

by timbo on Jul 3, 2009 12:10 PM PDT reply actions  

ron won’t put up 20 shots. he put up that many because he’s been the 2nd best player on pretty much every club he’s been on. he’s not a 20 shot guy. he became the go to guy in houston, for everyone else was hurt. he’ll be the 4th or 5th option here.

by chaucer on Jul 3, 2009 12:41 PM PDT up reply actions  

he doesn’t have the luxury to come in and demand anything. this is a championship team. he will come and try to fit in and do what is asked of him.

by chaucer on Jul 3, 2009 12:41 PM PDT up reply actions  

He is not

a better perimeter defender than Trevor. Trevor is developing into a good defender, but he can’t match the physicality of Artest.

by BruinFanBaby on Jul 3, 2009 1:53 PM PDT up reply actions  

you can tell ron artest that he is the 4th or 5th option as much as you want. that doesn’t mean he’s gonna listen.

by seanbergmanrules on Jul 3, 2009 6:09 PM PDT up reply actions  

Ariza was inconsistent as a perimeter defender

He got used and abused by Melo. Luke stepped in and started playing tough. Ariza gives up a lot of fouls too.
Ariza played LeBron well in the first match-up and played him so-so in the next game.

by 81 Witness on Jul 3, 2009 3:22 PM PDT up reply actions  

he is an average player, who filled a role with the lakers extremely well. i disagree with la times writer bill plascke about ariza having limitless potential. he isn’t going to be a star by any means.

by chaucer on Jul 3, 2009 5:23 PM PDT up reply actions  

Hey Timbo

How do you think Ariza will be received in the Rose Garden now that he is no longer a Laker? Will they still want him prosecuted for assault & battery?

Also, it seemed like the folks up north were pretty offended when Hedo’s wife said she didn’t want to live in Portland but preferred to make more money in Toronto. Can’t wait ’til the next time Hedo plays in the Rose Garden.

by lazNirv on Jul 4, 2009 12:07 AM PDT up reply actions  

The Lakers don’t believe he’ll leave, Lee kept barking. Surprise, surprise: Lee didn’t think the Lakers would tell him to get lost, sign Artest and leave Ariza to take the five-year, $33 million deal in Houston he could’ve had in L.A.

"I told Mitch that it was never about the money; it was about respect," Lee told NBA.com.

Well, take your respect and pack your client’s bags for post-Yao lottery land in Houston. Respect? Yes, there are American soldiers and missionaries in faraway lands cheering for David Lee and this noble stand for the neglected and disenfranchised everywhere. It is about respect, and God knows a $33 million offer for Ariza’s eight points and four rebounds a game rates a disgraceful act.

No, this wasn’t about the money, nor his client’s needs. This was a failed power play, an embarrassment of the highest order. Looking back, Ariza will rue the day. He’s a good player, but he’ll never be a star elsewhere. He’ll just be another player on another team.

"He was way too emotional about this," said a league executive who had talked to Lee in recent days.

Yet, you can be a star without being a star with the Lakers. When L.A. is winning championships, the role players become commodities. They get endorsements. They get television careers. Ask Rick Fox. Or Derek Fisher(notes). Ariza was an L.A. kid living a dream, 24 years old, a gifted, young talent on the defending champion, and his agent’s bluff backfired

by chaucer on Jul 3, 2009 12:38 PM PDT reply actions  

He gives the Lakers sheer nastiness, and as an executive with one of his past teams said Thursday night, "Ronnie will show everyone that he can win. I think he’s matured, and overall, he’ll be on his best behavior. Phil [Jackson] has been through this before with Rodman. He’ll handle this."

nastiness, indeed. something we’ve been lacking.

by chaucer on Jul 3, 2009 12:44 PM PDT reply actions  

"I hope it’s chaos," a Western Conference GM texted Thursday night.

And maybe, in some ways, that won’t be the worst thing in the world for the Lakers. Chaos? That’s letting your agent’s agenda and big mouth get your butt shipped from the Los Angeles Lakers for lottery land in Houston. Kobe Bryant had been willing to take back his whole team, but Ariza made the mistake of giving the Lakers what they always wanted, what they always believed was available to them: the combustible and crazy Ron Artest."

by chaucer on Jul 3, 2009 12:46 PM PDT reply actions  

exactly. that punk david lee and his big mouth put ariza in a tough situation. poor guy, oh well, that’s what you get for trusting a prick like that. shouldve signed with us when u had the chance kid, not a person in LA didnt want u back.

by chaucer on Jul 3, 2009 12:47 PM PDT up reply actions  

Ariza was Plan A: With the Los Angeles Laker boldly agreeing to terms with forward Ron Artest, General Manager Mitch Kupchak has landed a player the team has been itching to acquire since he was in Indiana.

The cost was the well-liked Trevor Ariza, who has agreed to sign an MLE deal with the Houston Rockets (~$32.3 million).

A source tells HOOPSWORLD that Kupchak was prepared to give Ariza an offer equivalent to the full MLE but at 10.5% raises, totaling at approximately $33.8 million over five years.

LA’s ceiling might have been a $6 million starting salary for $36 million over five but before negotiations progressed after 9:00pm Pacific on Tuesday night, the source says that Ariza’s agent, David Lee, took a confrontational approach with Kupchak.

Lee wanted a deal in the $50 million range and took offense to the team’s stance that Trevor should test the market first for that level of compensation.

By the next morning, the Lakers were going after Artest in full force with Kobe Bryant, Lamar Odom and even Magic Johnson reaching out to the Houston forward.

LA was acknowledging privately that Ariza was going down the path of Ronny Turiaf, a player the team had great affection for and wanted to keep but couldn’t because of economics.

Ariza’s agent ended up settling for significantly less money with the Rockets, at least based on the expectations he presented to Kupchak.

By getting a raise greater than 20% (he earned $3.1 million last season), Ariza’s contract has Base Year Compensation (BYC) status which is a technical term that indicates he’s difficult to trade. Should the Lakers and Rockets want to do a dual sign and trade with Ariza and Artest, Trevor being BYC makes that extremely difficult and quite unlikely.

While letting Trevor Ariza go was a difficult decision for the team, Kupchak reacted quickly. Taking advantage of Houston’s misfortune with Yao Ming’s foot injury possibly taking him out for an entire year, the Laker GM quickly turned to Plan B.

More here:
http://www.hoopsworld.com/Story.asp?story_id=13174

by intuitive on Jul 3, 2009 12:47 PM PDT reply actions  

Basically the Lakers could have offered Ariza MORE than the contract he accepted in Houston, but because of his agent’s insistence that Trevor was worth more Mitch went and pursued Artest.

Why do the fan favorites always leave? First Ronnie, now Trev.

by intuitive on Jul 3, 2009 12:49 PM PDT up reply actions  

If these rumors are true,

then David Lee screwed up worse than I think most people previously thought.

I wonder about the details of the supposed $9m/year offer Ariza left on the table when he agreed in principle with the Rockets. Which team? Toronto? Portland? How many years? If it was a one or two year deal at $9m per, I could understand his reasoning for leaving it on the table and taking the bigger total dollar amount. But if he walked away from $40-50m to take less than the Lakers initial offer, to play for a worse team, then I just cannot comprehend that decision.

I think Drew should learn from Trevor’s mistake and preemptively fire his agent.

by Darkemans on Jul 3, 2009 1:48 PM PDT up reply actions  

Well actually he said it was 9 million MORE than what Houston was offering (if I do remember correctly), which would be around 14-15 million. I really don’t think anyone would offer that much for Trevor… I think his agent just said that for “damage control” and to make out the Lakers and Mitch as the victim. You know, make it seem like for Lee and Ariza “it was never about the money” while Mitch was “all about the money and not respecting Trev etc” Thats how he wants to make the whole thing out to be, I don’t think that many people are buying it though

by intuitive on Jul 3, 2009 2:25 PM PDT up reply actions  

no one is. every nba expert knows what took place. and they are all saying ariza messed up.

by chaucer on Jul 3, 2009 5:21 PM PDT up reply actions  

Don't forget...

Fisher too when he signed for the MLE with Golden State. His agent Bartlestein is a good man, but GS wanted a veteran guard at the right price. Lakers wouldn’t shell it out.

by 81 Witness on Jul 3, 2009 3:24 PM PDT up reply actions  

i applaud mitch kupchak. he’s doing a terrific job. wow, even lamar odom reached out to him? okay, so when is he going to sign?

by chaucer on Jul 3, 2009 12:50 PM PDT up reply actions  

That same article says that Odom is not drawing much interest above the MLE

And that the most Odom can get is $6.5M – seems awfully low doesn’t it?

"This is not a game for boys. This is a game for men." - Phil Jackson

by Gils_Keloids on Jul 3, 2009 2:08 PM PDT up reply actions  

I hope so because we’re already deeep into the lux tax. Seems low, but there’s not that much of a market out there right now. Besides Toronto (OKC too?) no one can offer Lamar more than 6 million.

by intuitive on Jul 3, 2009 2:25 PM PDT up reply actions  

i didn’t see that. so what’s up with lamar? are close to signing him?

by chaucer on Jul 3, 2009 2:37 PM PDT up reply actions  

Which 5 stages of grief are you on?

Have you reached acceptance yet?

Or are you still at:

1. Denial
2. Anger
3. Bargaining
4. Depression

I think I’m stuck between Denial and Anger

Control yourself
Take only what you need from it

by PeanutButterSpread on Jul 3, 2009 4:39 PM PDT reply actions  

My initial reaction was NOOOO,

but I accepted it quickly, within ten minutes.

Now I’m looking forward to watching the madness unfold. It’s going to be fun.

by Darkemans on Jul 3, 2009 5:42 PM PDT up reply actions  

had we not replaced ariza with artest, i would have been very angry and depressed.

by chaucer on Jul 3, 2009 5:20 PM PDT reply actions  

um, what bronx connection?lamar odom and ron artest are from queens

by rawlo d on Jul 3, 2009 7:57 PM PDT reply actions  

Laker Quickies...

1. Ron Artest has bettered Tracy and Yao by showing them how to get to the second round. Orlando in 5, Denver in six, Houston in 7.
2. The Celtic experience made the Lakers tougher. Adding Ron just made the Lakers tougher once again.
3. Lakers: Smush, Kobe, Luke, Lamar, Kwame with bench of Sasha/Devean… almost beat the Suns in 7 (unfortunately for a Tim Thomas clutch 3). That same Suns team went to the Western Conference Finals. Fisher, Kobe, Ron, Pau, Bynum with bench of Odom/Luke. How many upgrades are those? Heck, even Farmar and Brown are upgrades over Smush.
4. Let’s see how Ariza does being the focal point of defense. Actually who cares! Let’s see how Ron’s numbers look like without being the focal point of the defense.
5. Lakers considered a possible scenario of Odom for Artest. Now, we potentially have both.
6. Artest can guard four positions, the 2, 3, 4 and with his strength even the 5 on rotations. Artest can offensively play 3 positions, the 2, 3 and 4. Ariza can guard the 1, 2 and 3, however can only offensively play the 3 in a standard NBA team. I ask you all, who is more versatile? .
7. Jackson has handled major egos: Jordan, Rodman, Shaq and Kobe. Ron Artest will be NO different.
8. In the end, though depth may help lead to a championship… in the NBA finals… a decent player like Sasha will not be playing big minutes. What matters most is the talent level of the starters and 2 bench players.

by SimpleTruth on Jul 3, 2009 8:23 PM PDT reply actions  

Trevor Agent Was To Blame

To think that Trevor’s agent said that the MLE was insulting and then the Lakers were able to have Artest come for the SAME money. This is all about the money, not respect, and if it were, asking for a 100% pay raise for 2 month work is outrageous. To think that he expected to get 7 million or more after 2 months as a starter is crazy. The Lakers were not going to back down from this guy again after the Bynum situation and in the current economics. So blame this ALL on Ariza’s agent.

by philipm35 on Jul 3, 2009 10:32 PM PDT reply actions  

I worry about Ron & Lamar hanging in Hollywood

Did anyone else hear/read that rumor around the time we lost those two games, one in Miami and one in Orlando? Supposedly Lamar was essentially out all night in South Beach the night before the Miami game and was still wiped out for Orlando.

I worry that Ron & Lamar are friends who like the distractions available at night in LA.

by lazNirv on Jul 4, 2009 12:14 AM PDT reply actions  

Ron Artest

So this article contained both pro and con, yin and yang, point/counterpoint, good and bad, etc. regarding Ron Artest. I vote for good. Here’s what I know. Last season and in previous seasons, the Lakers have had no defense, been accused of being soft, etc. Ron Artest’s “weirdness” and off the wall behavior notwithstanding, he’s been a good guy. I as a Laker fan am not going to get caught up in the fashionable pasttime of critiquing his character. What he brings to the table is something the Lakers haven’t had in quite awhile…toughness. The Lakers were a formidable team favored to win it all next season, now they’re pretty much guaranteed to do so and for several years to come.

by johnr1959 on Jul 4, 2009 2:01 AM PDT reply actions  

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